WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:05.460 Water, why does it matter? We all know that it matters. I mean, you all, I assume, brushed your 2 00:00:05.460 --> 00:00:11.020 teeth this morning and broke your fast with something resembling liquid. And we're all of us, 3 00:00:11.040 --> 00:00:17.900 all of us humans, like Adelaide's giant red river gums, we're columns of water. We look to water as 4 00:00:17.900 --> 00:00:26.460 the source, and the sort of source of our hope, as well as the life source for us. It's deep in 5 00:00:26.460 --> 00:00:30.280 our symbolism. When I was walking here this morning from the hotel through Victoria Square, 6 00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:36.700 I was looking up at that beautiful, very moving monumental statue of Charles Sturt doing this, 7 00:00:36.940 --> 00:00:43.740 you know. Sailors look like that to land, but I think in Australia, our characteristic gesture, 8 00:00:43.820 --> 00:00:48.960 when we're not swatting flies, I'm sure he's not doing that, is to look and look for water, 9 00:00:49.060 --> 00:00:54.580 look for the inland rivers, look for the life source somewhere, look in hopeful expectation 10 00:00:54.580 --> 00:00:56.160 in search of water. 11 00:00:56.620 --> 00:01:01.380 But we conceive of it very differently, and the fact that we're now facing a water crisis, 12 00:01:01.500 --> 00:01:07.960 I think, will reveal the rents, the fissures in our expectations of water, in our understanding 13 00:01:07.960 --> 00:01:13.120 of water, the way we conceive it, the way we use it as ritual, the way we use it as spiritual 14 00:01:13.120 --> 00:01:19.140 nourishment, as physical nourishment. Some of us have it, some of us do not have it. My next-door 15 00:01:19.140 --> 00:01:24.640 neighbor who has a vegetable garden that would rival the hanging gardens of Babylon, who's a very 16 00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:26.440 mild man, I thought was... 17 00:01:26.460 --> 00:01:30.320 He's going to become a revolutionary when water restrictions in Victoria went up to the level 18 00:01:30.320 --> 00:01:37.480 that meant that his tomatoes died. So we're looking to conflict, and this morning's panel 19 00:01:37.480 --> 00:01:42.940 session is a session in which a number of people from very, very different backgrounds can talk 20 00:01:42.940 --> 00:01:48.600 about not just the fact that water does matter, and it's a very scarce and precious resource, 21 00:01:48.700 --> 00:01:55.720 but why it matters, what we bring to our understanding of water, and can we reconcile the differences 22 00:01:55.720 --> 00:01:56.440 and the differences in the water. And I think it's a very important question, and I think it's a very 23 00:01:56.460 --> 00:01:56.740 important question, and I think it's a very important question, because I think that is the 24 00:01:56.740 --> 00:02:00.740 most important thing is how you bring the various needs that we have. I was at Janelle's wonderful 25 00:02:00.740 --> 00:02:09.480 session yesterday, extremely practical session about how you use land, how you use human capital 26 00:02:09.480 --> 00:02:15.120 resources, and I was just in conversation with her afterwards, thinking about symbolic uses of 27 00:02:15.120 --> 00:02:21.240 water, and from this very, to my mind, very practical woman, came the suggestion that one 28 00:02:21.240 --> 00:02:25.920 might think about something she'd just read. And as I was thinking about exactly the same thing, I'm 29 00:02:25.920 --> 00:02:26.440 going to read it to you now. 30 00:02:26.460 --> 00:02:33.180 to you now. The woman who's just won Australia's major and oldest fiction prize, Alexis Wright, 31 00:02:33.400 --> 00:02:39.340 who's a Wanyu woman from the Gulf of Carpentaria, has just written a wonderful book called Carpentaria 32 00:02:39.340 --> 00:02:47.520 and it begins with an evocation of a very profound symbolic notion and a very practical 33 00:02:47.520 --> 00:02:52.160 notion too of water. Just indulge me, let me read you a little just to set the mood for us. 34 00:02:52.160 --> 00:02:55.380 It's a chapter called From Time Immemorial. 35 00:03:22.360 --> 00:03:29.080 It came down those billions of years ago to crawl on its heavy belly all around the wet clay soils 36 00:03:29.080 --> 00:03:37.400 in the Gulf of Carpentaria. Picture the creative serpent scoring deep into, scouring down through 37 00:03:37.400 --> 00:03:44.440 the slippery underground of the mudflats, leaving in its wake the thunder of tunnels collapsing to 38 00:03:44.440 --> 00:03:50.440 form deep sunken valleys. The seawater following in the serpent's wake, swarming in a frenzy of 39 00:03:50.440 --> 00:03:52.140 tidal waves, soon to be a sea of water. The sea of water is a sea of water. 40 00:03:52.160 --> 00:03:58.240 The sea of water has changed colour from ocean blue to yellow of mud. The water filled the 41 00:03:58.240 --> 00:04:03.680 swirling tracks to form the mighty bending rivers spread across the vast plains of the Gulf country. 42 00:04:04.760 --> 00:04:10.760 The serpent travelled over the marine plains, over the salt flats, through the salt dunes, 43 00:04:10.760 --> 00:04:18.180 past the mangrove forests and crawled inland. Then it went back to the sea and it came out at 44 00:04:18.180 --> 00:04:22.140 another spot along the coastline and crawled inland and back again. 45 00:04:22.160 --> 00:04:28.800 When it finished creating the many rivers in its wake, it created one last river. 46 00:04:30.520 --> 00:04:39.140 No smaller or larger than the others, a river which offers no apologies for its discontent with people who do not know it. 47 00:04:40.140 --> 00:04:49.000 This is where the giant serpent continues to live, deep down under the ground in a vast network of limestone aquifers. 48 00:04:49.000 --> 00:04:53.500 They say its being is porous. It permeates everything. 49 00:04:53.860 --> 00:04:59.640 It's all around in the atmosphere and it's attached to the lives of the river people like skin. 50 00:05:00.060 --> 00:05:07.120 That's Alexis Wright, a 21st century Aboriginal woman whose understanding and knowledge of water 51 00:05:07.120 --> 00:05:12.660 is permeated by ancient knowledge and by very modern knowledge of limestone aquifers. 52 00:05:13.300 --> 00:05:17.760 Let's turn to our speakers. Janelle Allison, who comes from Queensland. 53 00:05:17.860 --> 00:05:18.780 As I said, 54 00:05:19.000 --> 00:05:20.060 an environmental entrepreneur. 55 00:05:20.360 --> 00:05:23.060 She's now living in Tasmania where I think she's bought 56 00:05:23.060 --> 00:05:30.680 is it eight hectares of ground upon which is going to grow raspberries which will need water. 57 00:05:30.780 --> 00:05:32.200 Can I ask you to welcome Janelle Allison? 58 00:05:38.440 --> 00:05:41.660 Good morning and thank you. It's a pleasure to be here. 59 00:05:42.100 --> 00:05:47.280 Yes, I have moved from South East Queensland to North West Tasmania. 60 00:05:47.560 --> 00:05:48.620 I moved from 61 00:05:48.620 --> 00:05:48.980 the 62 00:05:48.980 --> 00:05:56.520 a centre through the University of Queensland DPI and CSIRO, 63 00:05:56.640 --> 00:05:59.840 which was based in the Lockyer Valley on the Gatton campus, 64 00:06:00.060 --> 00:06:01.700 the University of Queensland, 65 00:06:01.700 --> 00:06:06.140 to take up a position for the University of Tasmania in the north-west, 66 00:06:06.480 --> 00:06:09.320 an area that they're deeply concerned about, 67 00:06:10.100 --> 00:06:14.800 an agricultural region, a mining region, a timber milling region, 68 00:06:14.800 --> 00:06:19.680 and it's my job to set up an institute for regional development. 69 00:06:20.020 --> 00:06:21.280 And that's my background. 70 00:06:22.400 --> 00:06:23.300 A geographer, sure, 71 00:06:23.440 --> 00:06:27.820 but now I spend a lot of time working with rural and regional Australia. 72 00:06:28.260 --> 00:06:32.800 And we were asked to make a short presentation, if you like, 73 00:06:32.860 --> 00:06:36.500 about water, but from the perspective of our expertise. 74 00:06:37.020 --> 00:06:38.720 So bear with me. 75 00:06:39.560 --> 00:06:43.080 My home country is the mulga of western Queensland. 76 00:06:43.600 --> 00:06:44.760 I know that... 77 00:06:44.800 --> 00:06:46.080 I know that rainwater is precious. 78 00:06:47.040 --> 00:06:52.420 The cool under the rainwater tank is bloody marvellous on a hot Christmas day. 79 00:06:53.080 --> 00:06:57.040 I remember the canvas water bag as precious commodity 80 00:06:57.040 --> 00:06:59.640 on my father's four-wheel drive. 81 00:07:00.760 --> 00:07:03.920 I remember that bore water had a peculiar smell 82 00:07:03.920 --> 00:07:09.560 and that it eventually laid to rest the magnificent variety of geraniums, 83 00:07:09.560 --> 00:07:13.860 which were my father's pride and joy in a dry bush garden. 84 00:07:14.800 --> 00:07:19.120 I know that drought means endless hours of scrub cutting, 85 00:07:19.940 --> 00:07:21.900 axe wounds, bushfires, 86 00:07:22.580 --> 00:07:26.800 and my mother pulling sheep alongside my father from dams 87 00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:28.480 as they became nothing but mud. 88 00:07:29.080 --> 00:07:32.900 I know, too, that it was drought and flooding rains 89 00:07:32.900 --> 00:07:38.240 which prompted my father to find the courage to take a town job 90 00:07:38.240 --> 00:07:42.980 so that he could ensure that his daughters received an education. 91 00:07:44.640 --> 00:07:44.780 I know that drought means endless hours of scrub cutting, 92 00:07:44.800 --> 00:07:50.240 so you could say that water was a very formative influence on my life. 93 00:07:51.020 --> 00:07:53.960 My expertise is regional development. 94 00:07:54.680 --> 00:07:58.220 Working with rural and regional communities is what I do, 95 00:07:59.100 --> 00:08:01.600 and practically as much as possible. 96 00:08:02.540 --> 00:08:06.860 Rural and regional landscapes are the places where I do this work. 97 00:08:07.780 --> 00:08:10.600 This work means that I've had opportunities 98 00:08:10.600 --> 00:08:14.320 to work in rural and regional landscapes across Australia, 99 00:08:14.800 --> 00:08:15.980 and overseas. 100 00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:21.860 In those places overseas, too, I've seen the spectrum of water use. 101 00:08:22.740 --> 00:08:27.000 From the single village well in a small village in Lesotho, 102 00:08:27.120 --> 00:08:29.700 which was featured in the news last night, 103 00:08:30.700 --> 00:08:35.720 where it was used for drinking and washing and carried home each day, 104 00:08:36.580 --> 00:08:39.860 to the mighty Burrito River in Kalimantan, 105 00:08:39.940 --> 00:08:44.280 so filthy and polluted that the small province 106 00:08:44.800 --> 00:08:46.360 is now a riverbed which goes something like, 107 00:08:46.520 --> 00:08:52.100 water, water everywhere, but ne'er a clean drop to drink 108 00:08:52.100 --> 00:08:53.740 is especially apt. 109 00:08:54.200 --> 00:08:56.700 But whether overseas or Australia, 110 00:08:56.880 --> 00:09:00.040 water is integral to the landscapes in which I work. 111 00:09:00.800 --> 00:09:04.500 Water in these landscapes is not a background given, 112 00:09:04.640 --> 00:09:08.320 rather it is a core landscape element. 113 00:09:08.620 --> 00:09:14.780 It is texture, patch, corridor in the landscape map, 114 00:09:14.780 --> 00:09:15.140 mosaic. 115 00:09:17.020 --> 00:09:20.940 In reflecting on water in the context of my area of expertise, 116 00:09:21.240 --> 00:09:26.340 I draw upon the work of an Australian geographer, Donald Mynick. 117 00:09:27.460 --> 00:09:32.080 In 1975, Mynick edited a collection of essays 118 00:09:32.880 --> 00:09:36.720 entitled The Interpretation of Ordinary Landscapes, 119 00:09:36.840 --> 00:09:41.060 a telling reminder still of what can be seen 120 00:09:41.800 --> 00:09:44.620 when we are prepared to, or given the clue, 121 00:09:44.620 --> 00:09:47.140 on how to read country. 122 00:09:47.960 --> 00:09:51.120 Simple, useful ways to better understand 123 00:09:51.120 --> 00:09:54.700 what we see right there in front of us 124 00:09:54.700 --> 00:09:59.180 in the ordinary landscape mosaics where we live and work. 125 00:10:00.580 --> 00:10:03.760 In particular, my favourite among those essays 126 00:10:03.760 --> 00:10:09.640 is Mynick's own essay entitled Ten Versions Of the Same Scene. 127 00:10:10.220 --> 00:10:13.860 Ten Versions Of the Same Scene reminds us 128 00:10:13.860 --> 00:10:22.160 that each of us view the same landscape or scene but bring to it different lenses or ways of seeing. 129 00:10:22.660 --> 00:10:29.000 I found this approach especially useful in working in rural and regional landscapes. 130 00:10:30.040 --> 00:10:37.760 It is an approach which helps to reveal all the different ways of seeing and values invested in landscape 131 00:10:37.760 --> 00:10:45.100 in revealing the nuances which might otherwise be hidden in seemingly ordinary places. 132 00:10:45.840 --> 00:10:56.160 So let me use Meinegg's approach to elucidate on what I've learned about water through the lens of my work and my passion. 133 00:10:58.280 --> 00:11:05.780 One, I've learned that the very words we use to describe water in the Australian landscape 134 00:11:05.780 --> 00:11:07.740 render us with fear. 135 00:11:07.760 --> 00:11:09.640 We're not aware of the feelings and notions of deficit. 136 00:11:11.000 --> 00:11:17.040 Tom Griffiths and Tim Bonihardy in their collection of essays, Words for Country, 137 00:11:17.820 --> 00:11:23.160 reveal just how limited our view of landscape and water in that landscape is 138 00:11:23.160 --> 00:11:28.820 because we continue to see it only in terms of presence and absence. 139 00:11:29.180 --> 00:11:35.820 Which is why the words of Alexis Wright resonated with me and the way in which she described. 140 00:11:36.280 --> 00:11:37.740 And I want to leave just that. 141 00:11:37.760 --> 00:11:39.960 I want to leave just a little bit more from her as well. 142 00:11:40.940 --> 00:11:44.660 This is moving on from the piece about the serpent. 143 00:11:45.220 --> 00:11:51.220 It takes a particular kind of knowledge to go with the river, whatever its mood. 144 00:11:51.680 --> 00:11:56.900 It's about there being no difference between you and the movement of water 145 00:11:56.900 --> 00:12:02.100 as it seasonally shifts its tracks according to its own mood. 146 00:12:02.640 --> 00:12:07.620 A river that spurns human endeavour in one dramatic gesture. 147 00:12:07.760 --> 00:12:11.520 Jilting a lover who has never really been known 148 00:12:11.520 --> 00:12:19.200 as it did to the frontier town built on its banks in the hectic heyday of colonial vigour. 149 00:12:20.580 --> 00:12:28.600 Two, water has taught me that truly robust dialogue is what it can be about. 150 00:12:28.800 --> 00:12:35.780 The British sociologist and social commentator Richard Sennott also wrote an interesting essay 151 00:12:35.780 --> 00:12:37.740 called the Dangerous Proju bursts into the silju bursts into the silju bursts into the silju bursts 152 00:12:37.740 --> 00:12:46.020 pronoun we, in which he argues that robustness is a willingness to listen and really hear 153 00:12:46.020 --> 00:12:53.200 what the other is saying. We may never agree with the other, but until we hear, 154 00:12:53.400 --> 00:13:01.600 we will never truly be able to reach some kind of understanding, and water is surely teaching us 155 00:13:01.600 --> 00:13:13.240 this. Three, water reveals courage to me. Perhaps others would use the word resilience, but I have 156 00:13:13.240 --> 00:13:20.580 found a resistance to that term amongst rural people. Men and women whose livelihoods have been 157 00:13:20.580 --> 00:13:27.460 challenged because of drought and who have found the courage to try new crops and different water 158 00:13:27.460 --> 00:13:31.580 regimes, like the fig grower in Tent Hill in the last year. I have found a resistance to that term 159 00:13:31.580 --> 00:13:36.020 the silju거야 silju 160 00:13:36.020 --> 00:13:39.440 silju거야 silju거야 silju 161 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:42.240 silju거야 silju 162 00:14:01.560 --> 00:14:09.720 occurring not just in biotechnology but also in the seemingly ordinary agricultural products and 163 00:14:09.720 --> 00:14:17.960 production such as lettuce with caught seedlings which completely recycle and have a very contained 164 00:14:17.960 --> 00:14:27.860 water watering system. Fish, rock melons and onions and garlic, smart business, smart livelihoods, 165 00:14:27.860 --> 00:14:38.200 smart water. And finally water has shown me that it can reconnect urban and rural populations 166 00:14:38.200 --> 00:14:46.920 not just upstream and downstream. When Morag wrote to us about what this presentation was to be about 167 00:14:46.920 --> 00:14:54.060 she made a comment about the blokes in her suburbs now talking as eagerly about their water tanks 168 00:14:54.060 --> 00:14:55.700 as their cars. 169 00:14:57.040 --> 00:14:57.840 And so I would say that I would like to thank her for her support and I would like to thank her for her 170 00:14:57.840 --> 00:14:58.000 support and I would like to thank her for her support and I would like to thank her for her support. 171 00:14:58.000 --> 00:15:02.600 And I would like to suggest to you that when blokes in the suburbs talk as eagerly about their water 172 00:15:02.600 --> 00:15:10.160 tanks as they do their cars then let me tell you blokes in the bush are pretty concerned about their 173 00:15:10.160 --> 00:15:19.780 water tanks too. And perhaps, just perhaps, instead of urban folk talking of desalinisation and 174 00:15:19.780 --> 00:15:27.340 bush folk talking of irrigation and environmental flow, perhaps we could have a connected conversation 175 00:15:27.340 --> 00:15:31.400 about water together. Thank you. 176 00:15:41.260 --> 00:15:47.820 Thank you very much Janelle and I should thank you for the comments about the ways in which we've asked our 177 00:15:47.820 --> 00:15:53.680 speakers to organise their thoughts but that's not to my credit. Robert Fidian who's on our organising 178 00:15:53.680 --> 00:15:57.320 committee writes very extensive notes for our speakers and so they're wrong. But I think it's a good thing that we're 179 00:15:57.320 --> 00:16:10.760 silju거야 silju 180 00:16:10.760 --> 00:16:12.040 silju거야 silju 181 00:16:26.720 --> 00:16:34.540 important part it plays in our lives in terms of producing our food, in producing the landscapes 182 00:16:34.540 --> 00:16:42.100 that we love, both in urban and in rural Australia. We perhaps aren't quite as connected with the 183 00:16:43.140 --> 00:16:48.600 importance, I think you're going to see in the next couple of years, that it is involved with 184 00:16:48.600 --> 00:16:53.500 the generation of electricity for you. I think we're going to start to see more of a connection 185 00:16:53.500 --> 00:16:58.700 between water and electricity, shortages perhaps, which could be a bit daunting. 186 00:16:59.680 --> 00:17:05.400 And I think we perhaps all underrate the sort of whole range of ecosystem services that 187 00:17:05.400 --> 00:17:11.560 water gives us in the landscape. But today's not the day to go about that because I took this 188 00:17:11.560 --> 00:17:17.860 challenge to take me into some new ground and explore some of the ideas about ethics and water, 189 00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:23.220 which I think are the debates we never seem to have. It's the sort of elephant in the china 190 00:17:23.220 --> 00:17:23.480 show. 191 00:17:23.500 --> 00:17:28.660 But we really do need to have a much more serious debate about the ethics of water. 192 00:17:30.000 --> 00:17:36.680 Now I guess we've seen in our lifetimes and we see in history that water's been a source of 193 00:17:36.680 --> 00:17:41.780 conflict and violence. The book of Genesis describes struggles over water wells in the 194 00:17:41.780 --> 00:17:47.840 Negev desert with the Philistines. Herodotus tells how Persian towns were subdued by filling their 195 00:17:47.840 --> 00:17:53.180 wells and water supplies and so on. We can find lots of examples in 196 00:17:53.180 --> 00:17:53.480 the book of Genesis. 197 00:17:53.500 --> 00:17:59.240 Even in our own history as we subdued indigenous community where we poisoned water and so on. 198 00:18:00.300 --> 00:18:08.240 So a pretty lousy global history driving conflict with water and we see that conflict every day 199 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:13.000 when we read our newspapers as we face water shortage. People think that their particular 200 00:18:13.000 --> 00:18:21.460 use is much more important than anyone else's. But on the other hand water can be a driver for 201 00:18:21.460 --> 00:18:23.480 cooperation and for the betterment of the people. So I think it's a good idea to have a water 202 00:18:23.480 --> 00:18:29.620 building of communities and it's been interesting to see that over the last, since 1945, there are 203 00:18:29.620 --> 00:18:35.600 something over 300 international treaties that now deal with water across international borders. 204 00:18:36.880 --> 00:18:46.720 So the idea that river basins themselves are an organising framework for communities 205 00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:53.280 has been driven by how those communities respond to extreme 206 00:18:53.280 --> 00:19:01.940 hydrologic events, both floods and droughts. So water can be a driver for our community and our 207 00:19:01.940 --> 00:19:11.260 bringing of communities together. And because in that sharing of risk of either drought and flood, 208 00:19:11.500 --> 00:19:17.220 one does have to share data and trust and believe the data. One has to trust and believe the 209 00:19:17.220 --> 00:19:22.440 technical expertise that people have. And so there's a very interesting interplay to me between 210 00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:27.140 that technical understanding of water and the political, the political one of how we share it 211 00:19:27.140 --> 00:19:31.780 and how we use it. And you can see that in our own example of the sort of squabbles we're having in 212 00:19:31.780 --> 00:19:38.200 Australia over the Murray-Darling Basin. But we do have a long history of social organisations 213 00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:44.220 around the globe that are organised around river catchments and their water. And we're seeing that 214 00:19:44.220 --> 00:19:49.440 in the move in Australia to regional catchment bodies that now all jurisdictions have got. 215 00:19:49.760 --> 00:19:52.020 So water can be a very powerful 216 00:19:52.020 --> 00:20:00.620 driver of cooperation and for reconciliation. And in fact, the negotiation over that water 217 00:20:00.620 --> 00:20:05.720 can be a sort of a ritual of reconciliation and perhaps even of creativity. 218 00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:14.120 Well, we don't seem to think about water until we're jolted by some extreme event, 219 00:20:14.320 --> 00:20:18.880 the current drought or on other bits of Australia, the current flood, whichever you'd like. 220 00:20:19.700 --> 00:20:22.000 It's these extreme events that we're seeing. And I think that's a very important thing. 221 00:20:27.060 --> 00:20:52.000 And the idea is that the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is the idea is 222 00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:58.740 of the snowy mountains, the turning back of the rivers into the inland and we still hear 223 00:20:58.740 --> 00:21:03.380 remnants of the Bradfield scheme, if only we could turn back those northern rivers and make 224 00:21:03.380 --> 00:21:14.940 the deserts bloom. So water is seen as a pretty important driver but water is also a very symbolic 225 00:21:14.940 --> 00:21:21.180 thing and I'm sure others will talk as much about the symbolism of cleaning and cleansing and 226 00:21:21.180 --> 00:21:26.980 healing that water brings. The very ceremony of baptism where we wash away sins and are forgiven 227 00:21:26.980 --> 00:21:33.860 and are in many ways reborn and the waters of birth are all part of that deep symbolism. 228 00:21:34.220 --> 00:21:42.380 The Quran, it describes water as the source of all life and a free gift of God. Now I'm not saying 229 00:21:42.380 --> 00:21:47.420 that water is the new religion but it does mean we've got to start respecting the spiritual 230 00:21:47.420 --> 00:21:51.160 values of water as well as the utilitarian values that we're 231 00:21:51.180 --> 00:21:58.520 going to have to live with and we squabble over. And so that rekindling of that sacred element of 232 00:21:58.520 --> 00:22:04.620 water might help us as we drive through the more practical debates and help us lead to a cooperation 233 00:22:05.140 --> 00:22:09.600 about the use of that water. But there are of course a whole lot of underlying tensions. 234 00:22:10.380 --> 00:22:16.260 Water is essential for life but it costs money to transport it and to get it to where people 235 00:22:16.260 --> 00:22:21.060 want it and the quality they want it. The cost is rising and so you run into equity, 236 00:22:21.180 --> 00:22:28.900 issues of should the rich have all the water they want for their lawns or should everyone 237 00:22:29.500 --> 00:22:34.760 have a certain amount and how do we use the market to stop waste and to distribute water. 238 00:22:35.780 --> 00:22:41.880 So the whole equity issue of should access to water be something for the wealthy or for 239 00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:47.220 the disadvantaged and that tension is caught up in international treaties. 240 00:22:47.220 --> 00:22:52.740 The International Conference on Water and Environment in Dublin in January 1902 put 241 00:22:52.740 --> 00:22:53.820 the tension beautifully. 242 00:22:54.320 --> 00:22:59.560 Water has an economic value in all its competing uses and should be recognised as an economic 243 00:22:59.560 --> 00:22:59.960 good. 244 00:23:00.160 --> 00:23:01.380 Fair enough, we're doing that. 245 00:23:01.820 --> 00:23:07.220 Within this principle, it's vital to recognise first the basic rights of all human beings 246 00:23:07.220 --> 00:23:11.780 have to have access to clean water and sanitation at an affordable price. 247 00:23:12.680 --> 00:23:14.240 So a great tension. 248 00:23:15.180 --> 00:23:16.760 The population growth. 249 00:23:17.220 --> 00:23:17.980 The climate shift. 250 00:23:18.020 --> 00:23:22.660 The contamination of our waterways means less water is available to each one of us. 251 00:23:22.840 --> 00:23:28.000 How do we share it between competing users in towns and countryside? 252 00:23:29.020 --> 00:23:33.020 How much water can we take from a river like the Murray before we destroy it? 253 00:23:33.180 --> 00:23:39.500 And the destroying of a river not only has utilitarian consequences for communities, 254 00:23:39.740 --> 00:23:42.980 but it opens up our obligations to other species. 255 00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:46.340 So I've been... 256 00:23:46.340 --> 00:23:47.200 Over the years, 257 00:23:47.220 --> 00:23:52.300 as I work in water, trying to think, well, what are some of the ethical principles that 258 00:23:52.300 --> 00:23:55.020 we should put on the table and at least start talking about? 259 00:23:55.940 --> 00:24:01.600 And the first thing that I see when communities get short of water is they look for someone 260 00:24:01.600 --> 00:24:05.880 else's water to pinch from anywhere else with a pipeline or whatever. 261 00:24:06.280 --> 00:24:09.660 And we've talked about the canals from the Kimberleys and other such things. 262 00:24:10.080 --> 00:24:14.880 Well, it seemed to me my very first principle of water is do not covet your neighbour's water. 263 00:24:15.320 --> 00:24:16.520 It's a pretty good start. 264 00:24:17.220 --> 00:24:18.440 But we all do that. 265 00:24:20.380 --> 00:24:24.420 We also have a tension between the upstream and the downstream communities. 266 00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:29.740 It sure is a better place to be upstream than downstream if you want to have first go at the water. 267 00:24:31.720 --> 00:24:37.260 But we've got the tension between wealthy urbans out competing farmers. 268 00:24:37.640 --> 00:24:41.560 We've got regional communities being scared if we use the market to buy water. 269 00:24:43.600 --> 00:24:46.320 So there's a whole lot of issues like that. 270 00:24:46.360 --> 00:24:47.200 What are our obligations? 271 00:24:47.220 --> 00:24:49.940 What are our obligations to our neighbours downstream in a river? 272 00:24:50.560 --> 00:24:58.020 And again, the ethical principle that seems to me to be a pretty good start is do unto others as you would have them do unto you. 273 00:24:58.460 --> 00:25:06.240 And that is at least a start to learning out how we share, how much we take, how much do we have to let go. 274 00:25:07.980 --> 00:25:12.540 And of course, balancing the needs of the environment with the needs of human communities. 275 00:25:12.840 --> 00:25:17.140 And we see during this drought when the very first thing that went out the window, 276 00:25:17.220 --> 00:25:17.900 was the environment. 277 00:25:18.100 --> 00:25:24.300 And yet that might be the underpinning element by which we sustain ourselves in the long haul. 278 00:25:25.320 --> 00:25:33.920 So the challenge for us is to what is a sustainable level of extraction and how can we keep to that? 279 00:25:34.960 --> 00:25:40.640 And it seems to me that the other principle then that I've got is maintain the health of your aquatic ecosystem 280 00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:44.740 because all other uses are dependent on that healthy system. 281 00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:47.200 So it leads to a lot of questions. 282 00:25:47.200 --> 00:25:49.780 It leads me to a few action principles with water. 283 00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:54.980 I think all people do have a right to sufficient water of appropriate quality to maintain themselves. 284 00:25:55.760 --> 00:25:58.540 I think we all have an obligation to use water efficiently. 285 00:25:59.160 --> 00:26:00.980 And I think most of us don't do that. 286 00:26:02.180 --> 00:26:08.760 No one's got the right to extract water that produces unacceptable changes in the health of the river downstream. 287 00:26:09.340 --> 00:26:11.840 And there's some challenges for science to define that. 288 00:26:12.520 --> 00:26:16.600 No user has the right to contaminate water that damages the downstream users. 289 00:26:17.580 --> 00:26:19.440 Water should be a public asset. 290 00:26:19.560 --> 00:26:25.320 And those extracting water for any purpose should pay the full cost of extraction on a volume basis, 291 00:26:25.500 --> 00:26:29.840 including the mitigation of any undesirable effects that their actions have. 292 00:26:31.740 --> 00:26:40.500 Those who use fresh water to create wealth and to create our foodstuffs do need to have security that they've got access to that water. 293 00:26:40.680 --> 00:26:46.900 And they've got to take some responsibility for, in their part, in sustainable water management. 294 00:26:46.900 --> 00:26:47.180 So I think that's the first thing. 295 00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:56.100 And I think we've all got a bit of an obligation to understand where our water comes from, where it goes, and to ensure we minimise our impacts. 296 00:26:56.200 --> 00:26:58.380 I think we've got to be all water literate. 297 00:26:59.220 --> 00:27:08.120 It seems to me those principles are a start for what might be a discussion on a new water ethic that we need to have in this country. 298 00:27:08.600 --> 00:27:09.180 Thank you. 299 00:27:18.580 --> 00:27:19.340 Thank you. 300 00:27:20.720 --> 00:27:21.480 Thank you. 301 00:27:22.380 --> 00:27:23.140 Thank you. 302 00:27:23.140 --> 00:27:23.560 Thank you. 303 00:27:24.140 --> 00:27:24.500 Thank you. 304 00:27:24.900 --> 00:27:25.340 Thank you. 305 00:27:26.620 --> 00:27:27.640 Thank you. 306 00:27:28.520 --> 00:27:29.280 Thank you. 307 00:27:29.540 --> 00:27:30.460 Thank you. 308 00:27:30.920 --> 00:27:31.400 Thank you. 309 00:27:31.820 --> 00:27:32.120 Thank you. 310 00:27:33.320 --> 00:27:34.080 Thank you. 311 00:27:35.560 --> 00:27:36.320 Thank you. 312 00:27:36.520 --> 00:27:37.280 Thank you. 313 00:27:37.280 --> 00:27:37.360 Thank you. 314 00:27:37.360 --> 00:27:38.020 Thank you. 315 00:27:38.020 --> 00:27:38.120 Thank you. 316 00:27:38.380 --> 00:27:39.140 Thank you. 317 00:27:39.500 --> 00:27:39.660 Thank you. 318 00:27:39.660 --> 00:27:39.720 Thank you. 319 00:27:39.800 --> 00:27:40.440 Thank you. 320 00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:40.920 Thank you. 321 00:27:41.520 --> 00:27:42.120 Thank you. 322 00:27:42.920 --> 00:27:43.180 Thank you. 323 00:27:44.020 --> 00:27:44.360 Thank you. 324 00:27:44.360 --> 00:27:48.180 whisky which means that the Scots become, sorry the foe becomes completely 325 00:27:48.180 --> 00:27:52.300 legless and can't fight you. I'm not sure how 326 00:27:52.300 --> 00:27:54.760 much people will cooperate across borders. 327 00:27:57.240 --> 00:28:00.320 I was going to say from the pragmatics of water which indeed it was 328 00:28:00.320 --> 00:28:04.420 not, Peter's talking very broadly and one of the questions I'd like 329 00:28:04.420 --> 00:28:08.460 him to answer later on is just how well received your very broad 330 00:28:08.460 --> 00:28:12.300 philosophical scan of our water issues, how 331 00:28:12.300 --> 00:28:16.120 it's received when you come to the hard business of convincing governments and competing 332 00:28:16.120 --> 00:28:19.960 interests but we'll come to that. Our next speaker is Rabbi John 333 00:28:19.960 --> 00:28:24.320 Levi who's recently been travelling in Israel where he's seen many things 334 00:28:24.320 --> 00:28:28.320 but also in the course of John's teaching and religious practice, water 335 00:28:28.320 --> 00:28:32.180 I imagine, I'm quite sure, is of paramount importance 336 00:28:32.180 --> 00:28:34.660 and John's going to speak from over here. Rabbi John Levi. 337 00:28:40.740 --> 00:28:42.180 People who are clergymen 338 00:28:42.180 --> 00:28:45.720 prefer to speak from platforms six feet above contradiction. 339 00:28:50.840 --> 00:28:51.800 I'm a ring in 340 00:28:51.800 --> 00:28:55.460 in this debate, however there are some things 341 00:28:56.380 --> 00:29:00.220 almost by serendipity that I'd like to mention to you. 342 00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:04.100 First of all the historical part because there are very strong 343 00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:08.320 links religiously 344 00:29:08.320 --> 00:29:11.540 and you heard hints of that a moment ago. 345 00:29:12.240 --> 00:29:16.520 And I love the new commandment, do not covet your neighbour's 346 00:29:16.520 --> 00:29:19.880 water and we've got to 347 00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:24.320 somehow put that into the Bible. Holy water 348 00:29:24.320 --> 00:29:25.580 is the topic. 349 00:29:27.460 --> 00:29:32.180 In the ancient Middle East, in Israel in particular, you know 350 00:29:32.180 --> 00:29:36.460 where to dig for archaeological finds because there are 351 00:29:36.460 --> 00:29:40.460 tells, there are hills made of ruins 352 00:29:40.460 --> 00:29:45.620 one on top of another. And why would people build one town on top of another 353 00:29:46.460 --> 00:29:52.960 and not start something fresh? Because water is scarce and these are piles of ruins 354 00:29:53.580 --> 00:29:59.200 are always built on top of a water spring. And one of the things the ancient people had 355 00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:05.460 to do was to hide the spring. So when the enemy surrounded your town, they 356 00:30:05.460 --> 00:30:09.840 hadn't the faintest idea where the spring was and they couldn't get water for themselves. 357 00:30:11.960 --> 00:30:14.260 And three of the most, 358 00:30:14.340 --> 00:30:17.940 four of the most important places that you can actually 359 00:30:17.940 --> 00:30:20.620 walk into these secret water tunnels 360 00:30:20.620 --> 00:30:25.500 are at Megiddo on the valley of Jezreel. 361 00:30:27.280 --> 00:30:28.960 Fantastic waterworks 362 00:30:28.960 --> 00:30:32.600 going back three thousand years at least. 363 00:30:32.700 --> 00:30:35.720 In Jerusalem, the spring 364 00:30:35.720 --> 00:30:39.820 that King David is reputed to have captured. 365 00:30:40.460 --> 00:30:42.780 And where King Hezekiah built a tunnel 366 00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:48.900 right under the city of Jerusalem, came out the other end of the pool of Siloam 367 00:30:49.580 --> 00:30:54.240 and when the two ends of the tunnel 368 00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:59.800 came close to each other, they worked out where they were by the sound of the pickaxes 369 00:30:59.800 --> 00:31:02.360 and actually put a tablet 370 00:31:03.560 --> 00:31:06.000 commemorating this engineering achievement 371 00:31:07.280 --> 00:31:09.980 at the center of the tunnel. 372 00:31:10.460 --> 00:31:12.780 And the tablet 373 00:31:12.780 --> 00:31:14.560 still exists. 374 00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:16.440 Very exciting. 375 00:31:16.680 --> 00:31:19.720 And that takes us back into the 376 00:31:20.740 --> 00:31:21.780 700's BCE. 377 00:31:22.600 --> 00:31:23.960 And there's Gibeon, 378 00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:25.740 fantastic waterworks. 379 00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:27.080 And Beshever, 380 00:31:27.240 --> 00:31:31.240 which literally means the place where there are seven springs. 381 00:31:31.460 --> 00:31:32.760 That's how important it was. 382 00:31:33.720 --> 00:31:35.660 And there's a religious festival 383 00:31:36.300 --> 00:31:37.300 based on water. 384 00:31:39.020 --> 00:31:40.440 Christians and the Orthodox Christians 385 00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:44.040 And Jews share, but they've sort of changed. 386 00:31:44.420 --> 00:31:49.160 The original Jewish festival was the festival of Sukkot, 387 00:31:50.220 --> 00:31:54.680 which was called in Hebrew just Chag, the festival, 388 00:31:54.900 --> 00:32:02.320 because it was timed to come at exactly the moment when the water descended from the skies. 389 00:32:03.520 --> 00:32:06.140 And if it didn't descend, you were in real trouble. 390 00:32:06.140 --> 00:32:09.280 So this was in autumn. 391 00:32:09.940 --> 00:32:10.900 Harvest was in. 392 00:32:11.120 --> 00:32:12.500 The new year had begun. 393 00:32:12.920 --> 00:32:21.080 And by the 15th, the 7th month, which is Septemberish, you wait for the rain. 394 00:32:21.540 --> 00:32:26.540 And I always scoffed about this until I was in Jerusalem. 395 00:32:26.920 --> 00:32:28.060 Very hot week. 396 00:32:28.240 --> 00:32:30.440 I thought, ha, they were wrong. 397 00:32:30.840 --> 00:32:35.420 And sure enough, before that week finished, suddenly there was a band of cloud, 398 00:32:36.140 --> 00:32:37.540 and you knew that it was going to rain. 399 00:32:37.760 --> 00:32:41.380 Because it doesn't rain at all in the summer in Israel. 400 00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:43.540 Months without rain. 401 00:32:45.620 --> 00:32:50.380