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<v Paul Davies>Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to this penultimate session of the Adelaide Festival of Ideas.

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<v Paul Davies>My name's Paul Davies, and it's my pleasure and honor to chair the meeting this afternoon with Owen Gingrich.

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<v Paul Davies>Just a couple of housekeeping points before we begin.

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<v Paul Davies>As ever, please turn off your mobile phones now.

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<v Paul Davies>Secondly, there is a time factor.

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<v Paul Davies>Because of the final session, which will be in this hall, which begins at 5 o'clock, we must depart sharp at 4.30.

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<v Paul Davies>Owen's presentation will last just about an hour, which leaves us 15 minutes for questions,

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<v Paul Davies>but we must keep those questions short and snappy, and must discourage people from coming forward at the end,

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<v Paul Davies>because this will impede the attempts by the organizers to get the hall cleared and ready for the last session.

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<v Paul Davies>So, if I could just...

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<v Paul Davies>If I could just ask for your patience and cooperation in basically getting out fast at the end.

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<v Paul Davies>Now, Owen Gingrich is an astronomer by profession.

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<v Paul Davies>He works at Harvard in the United States, where he holds the dual positions of Senior Astronomer Emeritus

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<v Paul Davies>at the Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory, and he's Research Professor of Astronomy and the History of Science at Harvard University.

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<v Paul Davies>So, he mixes...

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<v Paul Davies>He mixes an interest in contemporary astronomical research with the history of science in general and astronomy in particular.

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<v Paul Davies>And the subject of his presentation this afternoon is Galileo,

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<v Paul Davies>who many commentators believe was, in some sense, the father of modern science as we know it.

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<v Paul Davies>So, tremendously important, but also controversial figure in the history of science,

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<v Paul Davies>not least because of his perceived clash with the established church at that time.

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<v Paul Davies>I'm quite sure that Owen, as a magnificent scholar in this field,

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<v Paul Davies>is going to put an interesting and personal interpretation on the life and work of Galileo and his relationship to the church.

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<v Paul Davies>And I'm very much looking forward to hearing what he has to say and to seeing the slides.

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<v Paul Davies>And just one thing that occurs to me as an afterthought standing here,

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<v Paul Davies>and this is a remark to the organizers,

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<v Paul Davies>I will remember the last Adelaide Festival of Ideas being in this hall,

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<v Paul Davies>and the slides were rather badly affected by the house lights.

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<v Paul Davies>I don't know if it's too late to just appeal to these lights at the front being turned down,

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<v Paul Davies>if that's not already been taken care of,

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<v Paul Davies>because I think it will prove a bit of a problem for people at the back seeing the slides on the screen.

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<v Paul Davies>So, if anybody's in control of those lights, perhaps I'd be kind enough to dim them.

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<v Paul Davies>Anyway, without further ado, I will hand you over to Owen Gingrich.

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<v Paul Davies>Thank you very much.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Thank you very much, Paul.

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<v Owen Gingerich>In both America and Australia today, among those of us who take the Bible seriously,

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<v Owen Gingerich>there is a wide spectrum of opinion and considerable tension over how scriptures should be interpreted.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Did God really create the world in just six days?

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<v Owen Gingerich>Must we believe that a 500-year-old man put two of every three in one book?

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<v Owen Gingerich>A very kind of creature plus a year's supply of food into a closed wooden ship 500 feet long?

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<v Owen Gingerich>Must we accept that the earth is fixed in a geocentric universe?

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<v Owen Gingerich>After all, Psalm 104 says,

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<v Owen Gingerich>The Lord God laid the foundation of the earth that it not be moved forever.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And that was one of the proof texts that was very commonly used in the 17th century.

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<v Owen Gingerich>In the 16th and 17th,

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<v Owen Gingerich>17th centuries, which is the setting for my story this afternoon,

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<v Owen Gingerich>there was, as today, considerable ferment over how the Bible should be interpreted.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The Catholic Church had long taught that the scriptures were credentialed and understood

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<v Owen Gingerich>through the commentaries of the church fathers.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But in 1514, young Martin Luther performed an audacious hermeneutical act.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He published the...

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<v Owen Gingerich>The text of the Psalms with wide white margins,

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<v Owen Gingerich>omitting the standard glosses from Augustine, Origen, and the other early authorities.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The long standard allegorical interpretations were challenged.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Civil history had been discovered.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And Moses was seen as the first and most accurate historian.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's against this background that the so-called Galileo affair played out.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Perhaps I can sharpen this just a little bit by reading a paragraph from a recent book

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<v Owen Gingerich>by the Brown University biochemist Ken Miller,

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<v Owen Gingerich>a book entitled Finding Darwin's God.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The imagination of an age is shaped by its experiences.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And these, in turn, are colored by its knowledge and understanding of the natural world.

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<v Owen Gingerich>For thousands of years, humankind thought itself the focus of the universe.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Watching the sun and moon revolve around a human center.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And picturing the stars as decorations on a distant ceiling of the nighttime sky.

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<v Owen Gingerich>This view was confirmed by a story of origins,

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<v Owen Gingerich>detailing our species and all others brought abruptly into existence

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<v Owen Gingerich>by the direct action of the creator.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The great legacy of the scientific age

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<v Owen Gingerich>is the understanding that neither of these stories

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<v Owen Gingerich>are the same.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The science of the universe is scientifically correct.

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<v Owen Gingerich>For a dozen centuries,

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<v Owen Gingerich>God was seen as the lord of a great manner,

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<v Owen Gingerich>sitting just beyond the sphere of stars.

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<v Owen Gingerich>When the idea, the heliocentric idea,

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<v Owen Gingerich>of placing the sun and not in the center of the universe came about,

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<v Owen Gingerich>there was always kind of implicitly in the background

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<v Owen Gingerich>about the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the creator of the universe as the

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<v Owen Gingerich>how do you interpret these things, what are their relative stands,

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<v Owen Gingerich>was also a battle of turf as to who had the right to declare what was true.

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<v Owen Gingerich>That story, the one about the arrangement of the heavens, has long since played out,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and I don't think we have very much debate about it now.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now, the other story about the origin of the species is one that is still very controversial

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<v Owen Gingerich>and is still playing out in controversy.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And I think there are certain kinds of parallels in this story,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and I'm not going to draw those parallels explicitly,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but instead what I'm going to do is concentrate on the story of Galileo

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<v Owen Gingerich>and try to paint it with a certain palette of grays,

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<v Owen Gingerich>rather than in the stark black and white.

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<v Owen Gingerich>In the central cosmological chapter of his De Revolutionibus,

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<v Owen Gingerich>Copernicus exclaims,

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<v Owen Gingerich>Well, of course, that was a rhetorical question not intended to be answered,

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<v Owen Gingerich>because virtually everybody,

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<v Owen Gingerich>would have said, yes, it must go some other place.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Namely, out there, going around the earth every day.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The whole notion that the earth is spinning on its axis every 24 hours

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<v Owen Gingerich>seemed totally ridiculous.

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<v Owen Gingerich>I mean, after all, if it's doing that and you throw a stone up in the air,

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<v Owen Gingerich>it's going to land miles away.

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<v Owen Gingerich>We know, just from our senses, that the earth is solidly fixed.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And the interesting thing is that when Copernicus published his book in 1543,

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<v Owen Gingerich>he had no proof of the earth's motion.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It was essentially for him a theory pleasing to the mind.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Something that he saw in mind's eye.

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<v Owen Gingerich>A beautiful aesthetic view.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And it explains some things much better than before,

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<v Owen Gingerich>as far as the celestial mechanics and the appearances of the planet.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And it's not just the planets were concerned,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but it seemed just completely out of it when it came to the physics.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Did Copernicus believe in the reality of his system?

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<v Owen Gingerich>When the book was published, there was an anonymous preface added at the printers.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The clergyman who had been hired as a proofreader in Nuremberg

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<v Owen Gingerich>was brought in to write a kind of a,

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<v Owen Gingerich>little document to help protect the book.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He said, you may have heard something about the hypotheses in this book,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and are afraid that all of liberal arts are about to be thrown into confusion.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But don't worry about that.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's the astronomer's job to make observations,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and then to make hypotheses to be able to predict the positions of planets at any time.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But these hypotheses need not be true,

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<v Owen Gingerich>nor even probable.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Perhaps a philosopher will seek after truth,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but an astronomer will just take what's simplest.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And neither will know anything true unless it's been divinely revealed to him.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So therefore, if you're entering expecting to find truth,

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<v Owen Gingerich>beware lest you leave a greater fool than when you entered.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now the question is, would Copernicus have subscribed to that?

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<v Owen Gingerich>He saw it for the first time.

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<v Owen Gingerich>On his deathbed,

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<v Owen Gingerich>when the final pages of the book were brought back to him in Poland.

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<v Owen Gingerich>We can't be quite sure.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But what we do know,

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<v Owen Gingerich>is that Johannes Kepler,

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<v Owen Gingerich>the first astronomer to write an enthusiastic Copernican treatise,

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<v Owen Gingerich>after Copernicus himself,

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<v Owen Gingerich>was a realist,

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<v Owen Gingerich>believed it was real,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and believed it was a physical description.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And I think the same thing,

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<v Owen Gingerich>was true of Galileo.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's exactly why Galileo accepted this strange idea.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Well, I suspect it has to do with the psychological impact

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<v Owen Gingerich>of a device which he found out about.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He had been,

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<v Owen Gingerich>he had written a letter to Kepler,

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<v Owen Gingerich>said he was secretly a Copernican,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but he wasn't public about it,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and as he was teaching in Padua,

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<v Owen Gingerich>he taught the standard geocentric system with the fixed earth.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now if we can go to the slides,

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<v Owen Gingerich>I'll show you Galileo himself.

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<v Owen Gingerich>A very bright-eyed,

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<v Owen Gingerich>red-haired fellow.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He had been born in Pisa,

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<v Owen Gingerich>had gone to school there.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He was sent by his father.

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<v Owen Gingerich>His father was a musician.

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<v Owen Gingerich>His father knew that music was not a good way to make a living.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He wanted his son to be a musician.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He wanted his son to be a doctor.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo was totally bored with medical studies,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and there was a little family fracas,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and then it worked out that his father allowed him to study mathematics.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He became an assistant professor there at Padua.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He was so feisty and controversial that he didn't get tenure.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So he was lucky he found another job over in Padua,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and it was there,

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<v Owen Gingerich>where he had been teaching for some years,

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<v Owen Gingerich>when he heard about that there were peddlers going around with a spyglass,

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<v Owen Gingerich>something that made distant objects closer.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He didn't see one,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but he figured out by himself how to do it.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And he was,

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<v Owen Gingerich>he began to work with lenses and make the telescopes better and better.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And I use the word telescope anachronistically,

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<v Owen Gingerich>because it didn't have that name for a bit.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The next slide will inform you.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And he did, in fact, show us two of the telescopes.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's amazing because he made probably a hundred of them,

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<v Owen Gingerich>distributing them among the nobility of Europe.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And it's strange that only these two are authentic examples that have survived.

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<v Owen Gingerich>I think there's a negotiation going on about getting some of the lights down.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Yo-ho, let's have the next slide.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Thank you.

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<v Owen Gingerich>There you can see the two authentic examples,

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<v Owen Gingerich>which are preserved at the History of Science Museum in Florence.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Amazing that there are only the two Galilean telescopes still remaining.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He demonstrated it to the members of the Senate.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He was there in nearby Venice.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He was, of course, hoping for some substantial honorarium.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It was basically a military secret.

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<v Owen Gingerich>You could see ships coming in long before you could get them with your naked eye,

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<v Owen Gingerich>if you had this device.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But Galileo was filled with curiosity, and so he turned it to the moon.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And the next slide will show you what he saw in November of 1609.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He took this piece of watercolor paper.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He drew the crescent moon as it was hanging in the waves.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He drew the crescent moon as it was hanging in the waves.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He drew it with these little dots along the edge with such accuracy

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<v Owen Gingerich>that it's possible to get the exact date of his observation,

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<v Owen Gingerich>even though there's no date here.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He made a second drawing the same evening.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And then the next night he came out.

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<v Owen Gingerich>By that time the moon was a little bit higher toward the southwest,

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<v Owen Gingerich>so he turned his page the other way with this side up.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He drew another one.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And then a night or so later he drew another one down here.

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<v Owen Gingerich>You see he's putting it in in this random kind of order.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So I think this is the original sheet on which he made these washed drawings.

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<v Owen Gingerich>There's no text, but it was interesting because he realized

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<v Owen Gingerich>that these little spots of light were the tops of mountains

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<v Owen Gingerich>with the sunlight just clipping them.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Only illuminating the peak.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And he was clever enough to see that with a little mathematics

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<v Owen Gingerich>he could actually make a calculation as to how high the mountain must be.

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<v Owen Gingerich>But apart from that, he didn't really have much to write about.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Then in January of 1610, he turned his instrument to the planet Jupiter,

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<v Owen Gingerich>which soon after sunset was very bright.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And so he started looking for some light in the southeastern sky.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And the next slide will show us what I consider

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<v Owen Gingerich>to be the most exciting single page of manuscript in the history of science.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Because this is a page in which he wrote night after night about his observations.

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<v Owen Gingerich>I'm not sure if you can see it very easily,

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<v Owen Gingerich>because even I have some trouble making it out,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but here is the planet with a little companion,

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<v Owen Gingerich>side and one on the other. He was surprised to see these little stars, and so, he says, guided by

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<v Owen Gingerich>what fates he knew not, he went out and looked again the next night. And now he was very much

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<v Owen Gingerich>surprised to find that all three of the little companions were on the other side. Surprised

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<v Owen Gingerich>because he thought the planet was moving the other direction. So he was puzzled about that,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and therefore came out again to take another look. The next night, there were only two, and on the

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<v Owen Gingerich>other side, he figured one was behind the planet. He tried the next night, it was cloudy. So then,

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<v Owen Gingerich>the next night, and now he's got, again, one on one side and two on the other. So now he's getting

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<v Owen Gingerich>in earnest about this, and you see there's more text, because he's writing up more carefully

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<v Owen Gingerich>what it was he was seeing.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He tried again, and then again, and then this night, he got four of them, not just three. Three on one

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<v Owen Gingerich>side, one on another, and then he says, or better, and he draws it again with a little care about the

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<v Owen Gingerich>exact spacing of them. Because now, he's beginning to get the idea that these are companions, and

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<v Owen Gingerich>they're accompanying the planet, and they're going around, and maybe he can begin to identify them.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And so, here again, he's got four of them, and then again, he's getting in earnest about this, and

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<v Owen Gingerich>he tries to figure out where the planet should go. So then, he tries to figure out where the planet should go.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And so, here again, he's got four of them, and then he says, or better, and he draws it again with a little care about the

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<v Owen Gingerich>four the next night.

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<v Owen Gingerich>You turn the page over, the observations continue, but there's something different about the other side.

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<v Owen Gingerich>This side of the manuscript is all in his native language, Italian.

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<v Owen Gingerich>You go to the other side, and it's all in Latin.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Why? Because Latin was the international language of science, and suddenly, Galileo has realized

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<v Owen Gingerich>that he should have done something about the other side.

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<v Owen Gingerich>has made an important discovery that is going to be worth writing about. And in fact, he rushes his

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<v Owen Gingerich>book into print. You'll see the title page on the next slide. And then it's called the Sidereal

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<v Owen Gingerich>Messenger, brought out by Galileo Galilei, son of Florence. Wait a minute, I just told you he was

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<v Owen Gingerich>born in Pisa. Okay, this is a little piece of political propaganda. He is very bored with

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<v Owen Gingerich>teaching in Padua and having to tutor students and house them and all of this coming and going.

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<v Owen Gingerich>He was looking for a government job. He wanted to go over to the court of Cosimo de' Medici,

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<v Owen Gingerich>the young man that he had tutored sometimes during the summer,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and he wanted now to get a position because Cosimo had just come on the throne as the duke.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So he's describing what he's seen with this instrument, the perspiculum, and it says about

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<v Owen Gingerich>the spots on the moon, the circle of the Milky Way, and the four little planets,

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<v Owen Gingerich>which are going around Jupiter, which he proposes to call...

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<v Owen Gingerich>ta-da, the Medicean stars. You know what? It worked. He got the job.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The duke's personal secretary wrote, you know, what salary do you want? And Galileo said, well,

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<v Owen Gingerich>I leave it to his highness to decide this matter. I guess he sort of managed to get the hint across

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<v Owen Gingerich>that his salary had been abruptly raised over in Venice. He had always smarted in Venice because

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<v Owen Gingerich>his salary had been raised in Venice. He had always smarted in Venice because his salary had been raised in Venice.

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<v Owen Gingerich>His friend had come from peace at the same time and was the professor of medicine and had three times his salary.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And I always say, well, what's new? But there he was. But he did have a request. He didn't just want to be

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<v Owen Gingerich>appointed the mathematician to the Grand Duke, that is to say the astronomer. He wanted to be mathematician

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<v Owen Gingerich>and professor. He wanted to be a mathematician and professor. He wanted to be a mathematician and professor.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now, you'll remember in that anonymous preface to Copernicus's book, there was a little distinction

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<v Owen Gingerich>made about the philosophers seeking after truth and the astronomers just working hypothetically

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<v Owen Gingerich>with these mathematical models. Galileo wanted to be credentialed in order to begin to talk

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<v Owen Gingerich>about cosmology, about how the universe might really be put together.

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<v Owen Gingerich>When he wrote his Sidereus Nuncius, he didn't actually come out right away for the Copernican system,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but he did say something interesting. Concerning those satellites of Jupiter, he said,

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<v Owen Gingerich>we have here a splendid argument for taking away the scruples of those who are so disturbed in the

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<v Owen Gingerich>Copernican system by the attendance of the moon around the earth while both complete the annual

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<v Owen Gingerich>orbit around the sun that they conclude this system must be the only way to get to the moon.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The answer is, if you throw the earth into orbit going around the sun every year, how in the world can it take the moon with it?

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<v Owen Gingerich>Why doesn't the moon get lost? But, as he says, for our vision offers us four stars wandering around Jupiter

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<v Owen Gingerich>while all together traverse a great circle around the sun. He doesn't know how Jupiter does it, but Jupiter can do it,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and therefore the earth could do it.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And here is an interesting kind of argument. It is not an argument that demonstrates that the

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<v Owen Gingerich>Copernican system is true, but it is an argument that helps make the Copernican system more plausible,

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<v Owen Gingerich>more intellectually respectable, one might say. All right, let's go on, because the next slide

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<v Owen Gingerich>will show us what he was up to as soon as he got over there. Well, not quite.

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<v Owen Gingerich>I just wanted to show you Cosimo in all his splendor, so you get a little bit of an idea of

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<v Owen Gingerich>the luxuriousness of the court. And now to the next slide, which will show us a geometrical

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<v Owen Gingerich>situation comparing the geocentric Ptolemaic system with the Copernican system. Over here

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<v Owen Gingerich>on your left, you see a fixed earth. The sun goes around it.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It goes around the earth every day because the whole system is spinning, but then it slowly goes

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<v Owen Gingerich>with respect to the stars, so it gets around every year. The planet Venus travels on a large

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<v Owen Gingerich>subsidiary circle that lies between the sun and the earth, and the center of this circle always

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<v Owen Gingerich>keeps in line with the sun. So Venus, as it travels around here, is always reflecting

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<v Owen Gingerich>on the sun. It's always reflecting on the earth. It's always reflecting on the earth. It's always

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<v Owen Gingerich>reflecting its light back to the sun, and therefore you can never see a full face.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The best you can do is see a crescent, Venus. Now, in the Copernican system, it's the earth

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<v Owen Gingerich>that's moving, but just to show how it works, let me keep the earth here at this vantage point.

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<v Owen Gingerich>As Venus goes around the sun, and now you see when it's on the opposite side of the sun,

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<v Owen Gingerich>it can reflect light from its full face, and when it's over here,

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<v Owen Gingerich>it will just show a crescent phase. So if you could look at Venus with a telescope so that you

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<v Owen Gingerich>could see if it has phases or not, then you might be able to see what kind of phases they are and

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<v Owen Gingerich>draw a distinction between the two schemes. So the next slide, I have deliberately made fuzzy

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<v Owen Gingerich>to represent the way he might have been seeing Venus with his telescope, which was not all that

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<v Owen Gingerich>great. I mean, you can easily own a pair of binoculars, but you can't see Venus with a telescope.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So you can see that Venus is a little bit smaller than what Galileo had.

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<v Owen Gingerich>This is Jupiter to the same scale, just so that you can see that, in fact, Venus was very small

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<v Owen Gingerich>when he looked at it when he got to Florence at the beginning of August in 1610. You may ask,

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<v Owen Gingerich>well, why didn't he look at it before when he was doing his Sidereus Nuncius?

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<v Owen Gingerich>The only thing I can conclude is that Galileo really liked his sleep. I mean, there was no

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<v Owen Gingerich>evidence of getting up before dawn to have a crack at Venus, which was then in the morning sky.

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<v Owen Gingerich>All right. The 1st of September, still just a fuzzy blob. You could hardly tell anything,

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<v Owen Gingerich>whether it had a phase or not. The 1st of October. The 1st of November.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And then around November the 15th, he got a letter from a young protege who was a mathematics teacher

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<v Owen Gingerich>over in Pisa.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Saying, you know, you ought to turn your telescope on Venus because maybe you could sort out whether

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<v Owen Gingerich>it's a Ptolemaic system or a Copernican system. And this threw Galileo into terror because by this

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<v Owen Gingerich>time, the Jesuits in Rome also had the telescope. And he was afraid that they, if his protege

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<v Owen Gingerich>Castelli could figure this out, so could Father Clavius down in Rome.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo, of course, wanted to make all of the discoveries. This was part of his personality.

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<v Owen Gingerich>And also, he figured it was necessary for his status at the court. And now he was in a deep

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<v Owen Gingerich>panic. I mean, if he announces it prematurely, maybe Venus is always beyond the sun and it's

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<v Owen Gingerich>never going to show a crescent phase and it won't be Copernican at all.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So what to do? So he got an idea. He would encode his discovery in a cryptic little Latin epigram,

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<v Owen Gingerich>scramble the letters, write it down in a letter to Lorenzo de' Medici, Cosimo's brother, who was

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<v Owen Gingerich>the ambassador to Prague. By that time, Kepler was the royal mathematician in Prague. And clearly,

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<v Owen Gingerich>Lorenzo would show the

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<v Owen Gingerich>document to Kepler. And then Kepler would go nuts trying to figure out what it said.

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<v Owen Gingerich>So let's see it. Here's the next slide. We'll show you the letter that Galileo wrote. And here is the

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<v Owen Gingerich>anagram at the top of the letter. It says,

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<v Owen Gingerich>Haik imatura ame jam frustra liguntur. O-Y. Two letters left over. He wasn't able to get those

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<v Owen Gingerich>to fit in. It means sort of these things rested from me prematurely.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Now let's go on. The next slide will show what happened. Here is the planet on December the 1st.

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<v Owen Gingerich>that Kepler actually published it. Interestingly, Galileo never published it at this time,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but in a book about Galileo's discoveries, Kepler put it in. Here is where it says,

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<v Owen Gingerich>Heike Matura, etc., and then down here he has unscrambled it. Synthiae Figurus Emulator

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<v Owen Gingerich>Matur Amorum. Those of you who are really fast with your Latin will have got it. It says,

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<v Owen Gingerich>The Mother of Loves imitates the shapes of Synthia. Got it? Well, it's sort of double-blind.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The Mother of Loves is, of course, Venus, and Synthia is a classical name for the moon,

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<v Owen Gingerich>so Venus imitates the phases of the moon. Ah, now the plot thickens.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The next slide will show you the second slide.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It will show us Cosimo's mother, who was sort of the power behind the throne,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and she would have these intellectual brunches for members of the clergy, professors, and so on.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The court, I think, was down at Pisa or something, so Castelli got an invitation,

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<v Owen Gingerich>and Christina said, You know, how is this about these little moons around Jupiter? Are they real?

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<v Owen Gingerich>And Castelli said, Well, of course they are. Even Father Clavius,

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<v Owen Gingerich>has been able to confirm this. Well, she said, You know, how about this Copernican system business?

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<v Owen Gingerich>After all, Joshua at the Battle of Gibeon did not command the earth to stop. He commanded the sun

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<v Owen Gingerich>to stop. Oh, said Castelli, I'm sure Galileo can explain all of that. It must have come as a little

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<v Owen Gingerich>bit of a shock to Galileo, who wasn't really very strong on church fathers,

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<v Owen Gingerich>but so he went to work and read his Augustine and so on. The problem was no church fathers had

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<v Owen Gingerich>really discussed heliocentrism, hadn't ever occurred to them, but there were various things

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<v Owen Gingerich>about the interpretation of Scripture, and Galileo wrote back a letter to Castelli saying

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<v Owen Gingerich>that the Bible is written in the language of common people so that it can be easily understood.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's not supposed to be a scientific textbook.

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<v Owen Gingerich>The Bible tells

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<v Owen Gingerich>how to go to heaven, not how the heavens go.

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<v Owen Gingerich>It's just as wonderful in Italian as it is in English.

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<v Owen Gingerich>Well, that document then began to circulate around a little, and some of the clergy in Florence were

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<v Owen Gingerich>a little bit annoyed about Galileo sort of poaching on their territory, and so a copy of it

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<v Owen Gingerich>was sent down. Next slide.

367
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<v Owen Gingerich>The recipient, Cardinal Bellarmina, who was the leading theologian in Rome, and at the same time,

368
00:31:38.520 --> 00:31:43.920
<v Owen Gingerich>Bellarmina got a little Copernican tract from a Carmelite monk in Naples,

369
00:31:44.860 --> 00:31:51.240
<v Owen Gingerich>which had defended the Copernican system. And in his reply, the cardinal said,

370
00:31:52.000 --> 00:31:59.480
<v Owen Gingerich>since you have little time for reading and I for writing, I shall be brief. I've often felt that I

371
00:31:59.480 --> 00:32:00.920
<v Owen Gingerich>wished I could use that line in the Bible. I've often felt that I wish I could use that line in the Bible.

372
00:32:00.940 --> 00:32:03.580
<v Owen Gingerich>And some of the letters of recommendation that I have to put out.

373
00:32:07.900 --> 00:32:14.180
<v Owen Gingerich>First, I say it appears to me that your reverence and Signor Galilei did prudently to content

374
00:32:14.180 --> 00:32:19.320
<v Owen Gingerich>yourselves with speaking hypothetically, as I have always supposed Copernicus did.

375
00:32:19.600 --> 00:32:24.780
<v Owen Gingerich>In other words, Bellarmina had read that anonymous preface, and he thought it was Copernicus writing,

376
00:32:25.500 --> 00:32:29.960
<v Owen Gingerich>saying that this is all just hypothetical. He goes on.

377
00:32:29.960 --> 00:32:36.140
<v Owen Gingerich>For to say that assuming the earth moves and the sun stands still saves all of the appearances

378
00:32:36.140 --> 00:32:42.500
<v Owen Gingerich>better than eccentrics and epicycles is to speak well. This has no danger in it,

379
00:32:42.520 --> 00:32:49.220
<v Owen Gingerich>and it suffices for the mathematicians. But to affirm that the sun is really fixed in the center

380
00:32:49.220 --> 00:32:54.400
<v Owen Gingerich>of the heavens and that the earth revolves very swiftly around the sun is a dangerous thing,

381
00:32:54.580 --> 00:32:59.840
<v Owen Gingerich>not only irritating the theologians and philosophers, but by injuring our

382
00:32:59.960 --> 00:33:07.080
<v Owen Gingerich>holy faith and making the sacred scriptures false. Notice that distinction again between

383
00:33:07.080 --> 00:33:14.100
<v Owen Gingerich>the mathematicians and the philosophers. The mathematicians just doing their modeling,

384
00:33:14.260 --> 00:33:20.120
<v Owen Gingerich>their mathematical hypotheses. The philosophers really worried about how it's made.

385
00:33:20.600 --> 00:33:26.280
<v Owen Gingerich>Bellarmina goes on. If there were a true demonstration, then it would be necessary

386
00:33:26.280 --> 00:33:29.940
<v Owen Gingerich>to be very careful in explaining scriptures that seem contradictory.

387
00:33:29.960 --> 00:33:35.580
<v Owen Gingerich>But I do not think there is any such demonstration since none has been shown to me.

388
00:33:35.780 --> 00:33:40.760
<v Owen Gingerich>To demonstrate that the appearances are saved by assuming that the sun is in the center

389
00:33:40.760 --> 00:33:48.100
<v Owen Gingerich>is not the same thing as to demonstrate that in fact the sun is in the center and the earth in

390
00:33:48.100 --> 00:33:57.560
<v Owen Gingerich>the heavens. Okay, this is a little dense. Let me review for you Aristotle's posterior analytics.

391
00:33:58.340 --> 00:33:59.760
<v Owen Gingerich>We go on to the next.

392
00:33:59.960 --> 00:34:06.640
<v Owen Gingerich>Slide, which will show you something about the two forms of logic. Here is induction.

393
00:34:07.160 --> 00:34:14.440
<v Owen Gingerich>This is how we learn things, by generalizing. Robins reproduce by laying eggs, penguins reproduce

394
00:34:14.440 --> 00:34:20.320
<v Owen Gingerich>by laying eggs, and so on down. You get enough examples and you decide that birds reproduce by

395
00:34:20.320 --> 00:34:28.940
<v Owen Gingerich>laying eggs. Now, is this absolute truth positive? No, we haven't covered all the birds yet. There

396
00:34:28.940 --> 00:34:29.940
<v Owen Gingerich>might be some exceptions. But we're going to go on to the next slide.

397
00:34:29.940 --> 00:34:37.600
<v Owen Gingerich>So, we have something that's highly probable, but not guaranteed truth. If you want to get to

398
00:34:37.600 --> 00:34:44.240
<v Owen Gingerich>guaranteed truth, you've got to use deduction. The next slide will show us an example of how you

399
00:34:44.240 --> 00:34:49.720
<v Owen Gingerich>set up your premises. You have a major premise, like if it's raining, the streets are wet.

400
00:34:50.340 --> 00:34:57.300
<v Owen Gingerich>And then, as a minor premise, you say it's raining. And so, you conclude that the streets are wet.

401
00:34:58.460 --> 00:34:58.980
<v Owen Gingerich>Now,

402
00:34:59.940 --> 00:35:07.040
<v Owen Gingerich>back in Massachusetts, where I live, it may be that it's the winter snow melting that's made the

403
00:35:07.040 --> 00:35:13.540
<v Owen Gingerich>streets wet. I don't know. It may never snow in Adelaide. Does it ever? Extremely rarely. All

404
00:35:13.540 --> 00:35:20.040
<v Owen Gingerich>right. Well, then it could be the Adelaide street cleaning department has been out in force. If I'm

405
00:35:20.040 --> 00:35:26.280
<v Owen Gingerich>in America, I always say, well, it could have been the Budweiser horses on parade. At any rate,

406
00:35:26.380 --> 00:35:29.520
<v Owen Gingerich>now we go to the next slide, which will show you,

407
00:35:29.940 --> 00:35:36.460
<v Owen Gingerich>this logical fallacy that all students of logic in those days had to learn, which was called

408
00:35:36.460 --> 00:35:42.460
<v Owen Gingerich>affirming the consequent. You have a major premise, if it's raining, the streets are wet,

409
00:35:42.660 --> 00:35:50.800
<v Owen Gingerich>and now you say the streets are wet. As a minor premise, that's affirming the consequent, and you

410
00:35:50.800 --> 00:35:58.040
<v Owen Gingerich>conclude that it is raining. No, because as I indicated, there could be any number of other

411
00:35:58.040 --> 00:35:59.920
<v Owen Gingerich>reasons why the streets are wet. So, you have a major premise, and now you say, well, it could be

412
00:35:59.940 --> 00:36:05.780
<v Owen Gingerich>the Budweiser horses on parade. At any rate, now let's look in the Venus case. The next slide will

413
00:36:05.780 --> 00:36:14.280
<v Owen Gingerich>show us that one. If we have a Copernican system, Venus should show phases. We observe it. Venus

414
00:36:14.280 --> 00:36:22.780
<v Owen Gingerich>shows phases. Can you conclude that there is a Copernican system? Well, Bellarmina knew that

415
00:36:22.780 --> 00:36:29.040
<v Owen Gingerich>that wasn't good enough, and I'll show you why in the next slide. Because in the meantime,

416
00:36:29.940 --> 00:36:36.040
<v Owen Gingerich>a Danish astronomer, Tycho Brahe, had proposed an alternative system. And here you can see it

417
00:36:36.040 --> 00:36:41.960
<v Owen Gingerich>weighing more heavily in Urania's balance, so you can guess that this was put out by a Jesuit

418
00:36:41.960 --> 00:36:49.840
<v Owen Gingerich>around that time. Here is the Earth, solidly fixed in the middle, with the Moon going around it,

419
00:36:49.920 --> 00:36:56.040
<v Owen Gingerich>the other great light, the Sun, also going around the Earth, carrying its retinue of planets around

420
00:36:56.040 --> 00:36:59.700
<v Owen Gingerich>it as it goes in orbit. So,

421
00:37:00.420 --> 00:37:07.060
<v Owen Gingerich>Venus goes on all sides of the Sun, therefore it will show the complete set of phases.

422
00:37:08.600 --> 00:37:16.020
<v Owen Gingerich>So, just because Venus shows all those phases doesn't mean that there is necessarily a

423
00:37:17.280 --> 00:37:23.400
<v Owen Gingerich>moving Earth and a Copernican system. Up here it is. It looks so right to us,

424
00:37:23.420 --> 00:37:29.820
<v Owen Gingerich>but that's because we're all post-Newtonian, and we know about gravity, and we know the Sun,

425
00:37:29.940 --> 00:37:35.360
<v Owen Gingerich>as the gravitational object that's keeping everything in orbit around it. Frankly,

426
00:37:35.460 --> 00:37:43.100
<v Owen Gingerich>the tectonic system is physically a total dead end. And even Galileo was sensitive that that

427
00:37:43.100 --> 00:37:50.620
<v Owen Gingerich>was just kind of jerry-rigged and not going to get anywhere. But it certainly can save

428
00:37:50.620 --> 00:37:57.840
<v Owen Gingerich>the appearances if you are determined to have a geocentric system with the Earth and humankind

429
00:37:57.840 --> 00:37:58.540
<v Owen Gingerich>as

430
00:37:58.540 --> 00:37:58.780
<v Owen Gingerich>a

431
00:37:58.780 --> 00:37:59.000
<v Owen Gingerich>gravitational

432
00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:51.940
<v Owen Gingerich>!

433
00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:40.040
<v Owen Gingerich>!

434
00:37:59.920 --> 00:38:08.340
<v Owen Gingerich>fixed right in the middle of things. Well, this is the situation, and Galileo began to get

435
00:38:08.340 --> 00:38:15.660
<v Owen Gingerich>increasingly nervous that maybe the Copernican system is right, and it would be a great tragedy

436
00:38:15.660 --> 00:38:25.160
<v Owen Gingerich>if the Catholic Church would somehow declare that there was a geocentric system and that was that.

437
00:38:25.160 --> 00:38:31.980
<v Owen Gingerich>So, he wanted to make sure that the church didn't make a pronouncement on it, and he took a trip

438
00:38:31.980 --> 00:38:40.860
<v Owen Gingerich>down to Rome in 1616 to talk up the idea to leave it open for the possibility of a heliocentric

439
00:38:40.860 --> 00:38:48.980
<v Owen Gingerich>system. But that made some of the churchmen in Rome very nervous because they did not like the

440
00:38:48.980 --> 00:38:54.080
<v Owen Gingerich>idea of an amateur theologian telling them how to interpret Scripture.

441
00:38:56.360 --> 00:39:03.000
<v Owen Gingerich>So, they decided to take some action while Galileo was there, and the next slide will show

442
00:39:03.000 --> 00:39:09.340
<v Owen Gingerich>you one of the actions that were taken. They decided that Copernicus' book should be put on

443
00:39:09.340 --> 00:39:15.340
<v Owen Gingerich>the index of prohibited books, but because it had observations in that might be useful for calendar

444
00:39:15.340 --> 00:39:22.740
<v Owen Gingerich>reform, they didn't want to just ban the book outright. But on the other hand, it was just

445
00:39:22.740 --> 00:39:25.140
<v Owen Gingerich>so full of heliocentricism.

446
00:39:25.160 --> 00:39:31.760
<v Owen Gingerich>They knew they couldn't cancel that. So, they decided to take yet another tack. They would

447
00:39:31.760 --> 00:39:38.540
<v Owen Gingerich>simply ask people to correct the book in ten places to make it appear more hypothetical.

448
00:39:38.960 --> 00:39:46.600
<v Owen Gingerich>Let me show you two of the examples on this copy. This is the end of the great cosmological chapter

449
00:39:46.600 --> 00:39:54.420
<v Owen Gingerich>where Copernicus is talking about whether you would see any annual parallax of the stars

450
00:39:55.160 --> 00:40:01.020
<v Owen Gingerich>owing to the motion of the earth, some reflex motion of the stars. And that won't be, says

451
00:40:01.020 --> 00:40:09.460
<v Owen Gingerich>Copernicus, because the stars are too far away. So vast, without any question, is the divine

452
00:40:09.460 --> 00:40:16.700
<v Owen Gingerich>handiwork of the Almighty Creator. Well, now wait a minute. What's wrong with such a pious statement?

453
00:40:18.120 --> 00:40:24.980
<v Owen Gingerich>Ah, there's too much of a whiff of reality as if that is how God created the world.

454
00:40:25.700 --> 00:40:34.260
<v Owen Gingerich>So, that goes out. The next chapter is entitled, On the Explication of the Threefold Motion of the

455
00:40:34.260 --> 00:40:38.940
<v Owen Gingerich>Earth. And I can read it because I know full well what it says, but I don't think any of the rest of

456
00:40:38.940 --> 00:40:47.760
<v Owen Gingerich>you can get it. It says, On the Hypothesis of the Threefold Motion and its Explication. And there

457
00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:54.880
<v Owen Gingerich>are other corrections like that. It's interesting because this is the only case when the Roman

458
00:40:54.880 --> 00:41:01.940
<v Owen Gingerich>Index explicitly explained how a book was to be corrected. In many cases, they said this is

459
00:41:01.940 --> 00:41:09.080
<v Owen Gingerich>prohibited until corrected, but they just figured the local clergy could get it right by zapping

460
00:41:09.080 --> 00:41:16.660
<v Owen Gingerich>the right places. So, I know whenever I look at a copy of Copernicus's book, yes or no, was it

461
00:41:16.660 --> 00:41:22.060
<v Owen Gingerich>censored? And the next slide will show you the results of some of my researches over the past

462
00:41:22.060 --> 00:41:24.860
<v Owen Gingerich>few decades, where I have been looking at the results of some of my researches over the past

463
00:41:24.880 --> 00:41:31.480
<v Owen Gingerich>four copies of Copernicus's book and figuring out where they would have been in 1620 when they

464
00:41:31.480 --> 00:41:36.800
<v Owen Gingerich>finally got around to printing the details of how the correction should take place. Even if the slide

465
00:41:36.800 --> 00:41:43.520
<v Owen Gingerich>isn't in perfect focus, you can see the black symbols, which are the censored copies, and all

466
00:41:43.520 --> 00:41:51.500
<v Owen Gingerich>of these open circles are not censored. And so, in Catholic Spain, in the clerical libraries of

467
00:41:51.500 --> 00:41:54.860
<v Owen Gingerich>France, Austria, the book isn't being censored.

468
00:41:54.880 --> 00:42:01.000
<v Owen Gingerich>It gives an interesting insight into this affair. Those other places figured that was a local

469
00:42:01.000 --> 00:42:06.760
<v Owen Gingerich>Italian imbroglio, and they were having nothing to do with it. Well, the next slide, because we

470
00:42:06.760 --> 00:42:17.940
<v Owen Gingerich>need to march on to bring our story to a great climax. The other thing that happened was that

471
00:42:17.940 --> 00:42:24.140
<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo was called in to Cardinal Bellarmina and was told that this is a bad thing to be

472
00:42:24.140 --> 00:42:37.220
<v Owen Gingerich>teaching about the Copernican system or holding this notion and that he should be good and stop

473
00:42:37.220 --> 00:42:44.720
<v Owen Gingerich>doing that kind of thing. But rumors began flying around Rome afterwards that he had had to abjure

474
00:42:44.720 --> 00:42:52.740
<v Owen Gingerich>an opinion that he had held and had been sentenced to salutary penance. Galileo was upset. He got

475
00:42:52.740 --> 00:42:54.120
<v Owen Gingerich>Bellarmina to write him a letter about the oderation of the oderation of the oderation of

476
00:42:54.120 --> 00:43:00.220
<v Owen Gingerich>letter explaining what happened. It says, we, Cardinal Bellarmina, having heard it

477
00:43:00.220 --> 00:43:08.240
<v Owen Gingerich>calumniously reported that Galileo has abjured in our hand and has been given salutary penance,

478
00:43:08.320 --> 00:43:17.460
<v Owen Gingerich>no such thing has happened. He was just told about not holding this opinion and that it was

479
00:43:17.460 --> 00:43:23.260
<v Owen Gingerich>going to be put on the index of prohibited books. This became a very important document

480
00:43:23.260 --> 00:43:29.840
<v Owen Gingerich>because a number of years later, when Bellarmina was no longer alive and Galileo was being challenged

481
00:43:29.840 --> 00:43:37.900
<v Owen Gingerich>for what he had done, it became very important to know what it was that had happened in Rome in 1616.

482
00:43:38.540 --> 00:43:45.700
<v Owen Gingerich>But in any event, Galileo went back to Florence and he behaved himself. But he was still very

483
00:43:45.700 --> 00:43:51.440
<v Owen Gingerich>feisty and scrappy and got into quite a row with the Jesuits about the nature of comets.

484
00:43:51.700 --> 00:43:53.160
<v Owen Gingerich>The fact is,

485
00:43:53.260 --> 00:44:00.440
<v Owen Gingerich>that the Jesuits were right and Galileo was wrong, but Galileo was such a witty writer and so clever,

486
00:44:00.560 --> 00:44:12.540
<v Owen Gingerich>he still managed to make fools of them. So, no love lost there. And then, in 1623, I think it was 23,

487
00:44:12.780 --> 00:44:21.000
<v Owen Gingerich>maybe 24, a new pope was elected. And this was gladdened the hearts of the liberal Catholics

488
00:44:21.000 --> 00:44:23.240
<v Owen Gingerich>because the new pope was elected. And this was gladdened the hearts of the liberal Catholics

489
00:44:23.260 --> 00:44:27.740
<v Owen Gingerich>because the new pope, Urban VIII, was known to be a great patron of the arts and of the sciences.

490
00:44:27.900 --> 00:44:34.260
<v Owen Gingerich>He was a fellow member with Galileo in a small group called the Academy of Lynxes.

491
00:44:34.760 --> 00:44:41.240
<v Owen Gingerich>And so, Galileo organized to take a trip down to see him. The next slide will show us Urban VIII,

492
00:44:42.500 --> 00:44:49.200
<v Owen Gingerich>a Florentine, and so he knew him. And they had some audiences in the Vatican gardens.

493
00:44:50.740 --> 00:44:53.140
<v Owen Gingerich>And I suppose Galileo,

494
00:44:53.260 --> 00:45:00.520
<v Owen Gingerich>said, you know, I really want to write a book about cosmological systems, but my enemies have

495
00:45:00.520 --> 00:45:05.560
<v Owen Gingerich>prevented me from doing this kind of thing. And Urban may very well have said, by the way,

496
00:45:05.680 --> 00:45:11.640
<v Owen Gingerich>I was the one that prevented the Copernican system from being announced as heretical

497
00:45:11.640 --> 00:45:17.720
<v Owen Gingerich>back there in 1616. I don't see any reason why you shouldn't write a book like this.

498
00:45:18.220 --> 00:45:23.160
<v Owen Gingerich>And Galileo, he said, remember, though, you have,

499
00:45:23.260 --> 00:45:27.000
<v Owen Gingerich>to keep it hypothetical because you don't have any proof for this Copernican system.

500
00:45:27.460 --> 00:45:33.780
<v Owen Gingerich>And Galileo may very well have said, well, I think I have a proof from the tides. I don't

501
00:45:33.780 --> 00:45:40.320
<v Owen Gingerich>understand how tides can be formed unless you have the earth moving to get the water sloshing

502
00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:45.540
<v Owen Gingerich>back and forth. And I propose to call my book on the flux and reflux of the sea.

503
00:45:46.260 --> 00:45:52.160
<v Owen Gingerich>And Urban said, no, no, that won't do at all because God and his infinite wisdom and power

504
00:45:52.160 --> 00:45:53.240
<v Owen Gingerich>could have made it. And so, he wrote a book called The Flux and Reflux of the Sea.

505
00:45:53.260 --> 00:46:00.060
<v Owen Gingerich>The tides in many other ways, including those beyond human intellect. So, just because a

506
00:46:00.060 --> 00:46:06.180
<v Owen Gingerich>Copernican system could make the tides doesn't mean because you have the tides that there's

507
00:46:06.180 --> 00:46:11.860
<v Owen Gingerich>necessarily a Copernican system. I hope you see the echo here of the arguments that Bellarmina

508
00:46:11.860 --> 00:46:20.540
<v Owen Gingerich>had used earlier. So, Galileo goes back. He's not always well, so it takes him a long time to get

509
00:46:20.540 --> 00:46:23.240
<v Owen Gingerich>the book written. And now, finally, he's back. And he's back. And he's back. And he's back. And

510
00:46:23.260 --> 00:46:28.320
<v Owen Gingerich>finally, it's ready to be printed in 1632. And the next slide will show us the wonderful

511
00:46:28.320 --> 00:46:36.400
<v Owen Gingerich>frontispiece of the book where you see the three figures, Aristotle, Ptolemy, and Copernicus,

512
00:46:36.520 --> 00:46:44.560
<v Owen Gingerich>the guy with this heliocentric egg beater down here. So, there are three characters in this

513
00:46:44.560 --> 00:46:52.820
<v Owen Gingerich>dialogue. Salviati, who is clearly a mouthpiece for Galileo. He's the young, energetic philosopher.

514
00:46:53.660 --> 00:47:02.280
<v Owen Gingerich>There is Sagredo, named after someone that Galileo had known in Venice, a sort of wise,

515
00:47:02.900 --> 00:47:09.060
<v Owen Gingerich>elderly statesman type of person who's neutral and who can listen to the arguments and come to

516
00:47:09.060 --> 00:47:16.060
<v Owen Gingerich>a judgment, usually in favor of Salviati, of course. And then there is the Aristotelian,

517
00:47:16.660 --> 00:47:22.940
<v Owen Gingerich>Simplicio. Now, you all laugh, just as the Italians did, because,

518
00:47:23.260 --> 00:47:29.260
<v Owen Gingerich>although Simplicio happens to be legitimately the name of a 6th century commentator on Aristotle,

519
00:47:30.500 --> 00:47:33.460
<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo knew full well that it also meant blockhead.

520
00:47:34.600 --> 00:47:42.620
<v Owen Gingerich>So, you go through and you have this dialogue for four days, going through the various arguments.

521
00:47:43.420 --> 00:47:51.620
<v Owen Gingerich>None of these arguments can prove the heliocentric system. But argument after argument

522
00:47:51.620 --> 00:47:53.240
<v Owen Gingerich>makes the argument.

523
00:47:53.260 --> 00:48:03.340
<v Owen Gingerich>The case more probable. And I often say that this book is not the greatest of scientific books in

524
00:48:03.340 --> 00:48:10.160
<v Owen Gingerich>this period by any means, but it's the book that won the war. Because it's the book that made the

525
00:48:10.160 --> 00:48:15.820
<v Owen Gingerich>Copernican system intellectually respectable. Something that you could take seriously.

526
00:48:18.340 --> 00:48:23.160
<v Owen Gingerich>And then, towards the end of the fourth day, the argument from the tides is,

527
00:48:23.260 --> 00:48:27.940
<v Owen Gingerich>and of course, Sagrito says, this is really wonderful. I don't understand why nobody thought

528
00:48:27.940 --> 00:48:36.180
<v Owen Gingerich>of this earlier. And Simplicio has to concede that it's pretty clever. And he says, but I always

529
00:48:36.180 --> 00:48:41.600
<v Owen Gingerich>remember what a most eminent personage has told me, that God in his infinite power and wisdom

530
00:48:41.600 --> 00:48:47.940
<v Owen Gingerich>could have made the tides by many other ways, including those beyond human intellect. Well,

531
00:48:48.900 --> 00:48:52.900
<v Owen Gingerich>with that, when the book came out, the mud hit the fan.

532
00:48:53.260 --> 00:49:02.920
<v Owen Gingerich>I mean, Urban's advisors convinced him that he was the model for Simplicio. After all,

533
00:49:03.080 --> 00:49:10.820
<v Owen Gingerich>his words were there in Simplicio's mouth. What I think is that Urban expected a technical treatise

534
00:49:10.820 --> 00:49:17.180
<v Owen Gingerich>filled with diagrams, detailed, intricate comparisons of the two hypotheses and how

535
00:49:17.180 --> 00:49:20.480
<v Owen Gingerich>they went about predicting planets. And that's not what he got.

536
00:49:20.480 --> 00:49:28.800
<v Owen Gingerich>There was only one diagram in, not a technical one at all. It just, I mean, as far as the planetary

537
00:49:28.800 --> 00:49:38.940
<v Owen Gingerich>systems were concerned, a heliocentric diagram to show how you got, to help show how retrograde

538
00:49:38.940 --> 00:49:48.660
<v Owen Gingerich>motion occurred. In any event, Urban was outraged. And he said that Galileo had to come down and

539
00:49:48.660 --> 00:49:50.460
<v Owen Gingerich>face the consequences of the

540
00:49:50.480 --> 00:49:56.620
<v Owen Gingerich>consequences. And if he wasn't prepared to come right away, he would come down to Rome in chains.

541
00:49:57.100 --> 00:50:02.280
<v Owen Gingerich>It wasn't a very easy time. Galileo was 70. It meant crossing the mountains in winter,

542
00:50:02.380 --> 00:50:09.580
<v Owen Gingerich>the Apennines. And furthermore, there was plague in Florence, so that when he reached the border

543
00:50:09.580 --> 00:50:15.780
<v Owen Gingerich>of Tuscany, he was promptly clapped into quarantine. Quarantine is, of course, an Italian

544
00:50:15.780 --> 00:50:20.360
<v Owen Gingerich>word meaning 40, 40 days to be...

545
00:50:20.480 --> 00:50:27.420
<v Owen Gingerich>to sit there and to make sure he didn't have the plague. And then proceeded down to Rome,

546
00:50:28.080 --> 00:50:38.240
<v Owen Gingerich>where his spies told him that the Inquisition had found in the archives an injunction,

547
00:50:39.080 --> 00:50:46.220
<v Owen Gingerich>which had said that Galileo was not supposed to teach the Copernican system, which he clearly had

548
00:50:46.220 --> 00:50:50.460
<v Owen Gingerich>done. The only problem was it wasn't signed or notarized. And so, he was told that Galileo was

549
00:50:50.480 --> 00:50:51.380
<v Owen Gingerich>not supposed to teach the Copernican system, which he clearly had done. And so, he was told that

550
00:50:51.380 --> 00:50:56.480
<v Owen Gingerich>it wasn't a legal document. It wasn't clear, in fact, that the document had actually ever been

551
00:50:56.480 --> 00:51:04.520
<v Owen Gingerich>served. So, Galileo, they sort of beat around the bush with the questioning, and Galileo knew what

552
00:51:04.520 --> 00:51:13.060
<v Owen Gingerich>was up, and finally then produced his letter from Bellarmina saying that no injunction, no penance,

553
00:51:13.120 --> 00:51:19.060
<v Owen Gingerich>and no abjuration had taken place. The Inquisition,

554
00:51:19.060 --> 00:51:27.040
<v Owen Gingerich>uh, was thrown into some confusion and recessed the trial, and Galileo understood the politics

555
00:51:27.040 --> 00:51:34.900
<v Owen Gingerich>well enough. There was the Thirty Years' War going on. The Spanish cardinals were at

556
00:51:34.900 --> 00:51:41.960
<v Owen Gingerich>swords points to the French cardinals. Urban was walking a political tightrope.

557
00:51:42.660 --> 00:51:48.900
<v Owen Gingerich>He couldn't lose face by having brought Galileo down so conspicuously, and then just

558
00:51:48.900 --> 00:51:49.040
<v Owen Gingerich>lost his face. And so, he was thrown into some confusion and recessed the trial. And Galileo

559
00:51:49.040 --> 00:51:56.820
<v Owen Gingerich>was going to punish Galileo as a son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son

560
00:51:56.820 --> 00:52:00.300
<v Owen Gingerich>of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son

561
00:52:00.300 --> 00:52:02.820
<v Owen Gingerich>of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son

562
00:52:02.820 --> 00:52:02.860
<v Owen Gingerich>of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son

563
00:52:02.860 --> 00:52:13.680
<v Owen Gingerich>of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son of the son

564
00:52:13.680 --> 00:52:19.920
<v Owen Gingerich>That is the word tortua, that he is vehemently suspected.

565
00:52:20.500 --> 00:52:21.560
<v Owen Gingerich>That's in here.

566
00:52:21.700 --> 00:52:29.100
<v Owen Gingerich>Now, to use the instruments of torture, you can't just suspect somebody of heresy.

567
00:52:29.200 --> 00:52:32.200
<v Owen Gingerich>You've got to vehemently suspect them.

568
00:52:32.340 --> 00:52:34.580
<v Owen Gingerich>So this is just legalese.

569
00:52:34.960 --> 00:52:41.380
<v Owen Gingerich>And I think that probably a man of his age and stature was not shown the instruments of torture.

570
00:52:41.380 --> 00:52:49.240
<v Owen Gingerich>This is simply to say how hard they could press him in the questioning about what he had been up to.

571
00:52:49.280 --> 00:52:53.360
<v Owen Gingerich>He said he had gone too far in writing the dialogo.

572
00:52:53.360 --> 00:52:53.940
<v Owen Gingerich>He was sorry.

573
00:52:54.040 --> 00:52:57.740
<v Owen Gingerich>He would be prepared to rewrite it some for them.

574
00:52:59.500 --> 00:53:06.140
<v Owen Gingerich>The next slide will carry on with a couple pages later when they're going to press him even harder.

575
00:53:06.940 --> 00:53:08.820
<v Owen Gingerich>There is ad tortua again.

576
00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:10.800
<v Owen Gingerich>And this time...

577
00:53:11.380 --> 00:53:18.740
<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo, after denying having those potentially heretical thoughts, signs off on the document.

578
00:53:18.900 --> 00:53:22.860
<v Owen Gingerich>You can hardly see it because of the show-through, but there is Galileo's autograph.

579
00:53:24.220 --> 00:53:34.720
<v Owen Gingerich>And the next day, he was brought before a group of Dominicans to have a public confession.

580
00:53:35.940 --> 00:53:41.360
<v Owen Gingerich>The next slide will show us it in kind of Victorian terms.

581
00:53:41.380 --> 00:53:44.340
<v Owen Gingerich>Martyrs of science from the 19th century.

582
00:53:44.460 --> 00:53:45.860
<v Owen Gingerich>Totally phony picture.

583
00:53:46.700 --> 00:53:48.720
<v Owen Gingerich>He would have been in the white robes of a penitent.

584
00:53:48.860 --> 00:53:51.600
<v Owen Gingerich>There's no way he would have been turning around and saying,

585
00:53:52.300 --> 00:53:52.880
<v Owen Gingerich>But it moves.

586
00:53:53.220 --> 00:53:54.900
<v Owen Gingerich>I mean, he wasn't a fool.

587
00:53:58.800 --> 00:54:05.280
<v Owen Gingerich>But it was for him a very humiliating and disheartening experience

588
00:54:05.900 --> 00:54:10.400
<v Owen Gingerich>to say that he had not held or...

589
00:54:11.380 --> 00:54:13.140
<v Owen Gingerich>or believed in this,

590
00:54:13.720 --> 00:54:18.420
<v Owen Gingerich>and that he would promptly report any heretics and so on.

591
00:54:18.560 --> 00:54:20.780
<v Owen Gingerich>I mean, was he perjuring himself?

592
00:54:22.100 --> 00:54:23.480
<v Owen Gingerich>Well, it's hard to know.

593
00:54:23.780 --> 00:54:25.400
<v Owen Gingerich>He was terrified.

594
00:54:25.880 --> 00:54:30.760
<v Owen Gingerich>He knew he never had a deductive proof for this system.

595
00:54:31.440 --> 00:54:35.580
<v Owen Gingerich>And he might have been up there quaking and thinking that,

596
00:54:36.960 --> 00:54:38.900
<v Owen Gingerich>I wish I could have proved it.

597
00:54:38.940 --> 00:54:40.880
<v Owen Gingerich>It seemed so beautiful as a theory.

598
00:54:40.880 --> 00:54:41.960
<v Owen Gingerich>It seemed so right.

599
00:54:42.040 --> 00:54:44.060
<v Owen Gingerich>But I haven't been able to find the proof.

600
00:54:44.320 --> 00:54:46.960
<v Owen Gingerich>And without the proof, could I have believed it?

601
00:54:47.740 --> 00:54:49.000
<v Owen Gingerich>I guess I didn't.

602
00:54:49.200 --> 00:54:51.720
<v Owen Gingerich>Honest guys, I never believed that.

603
00:54:52.680 --> 00:54:54.260
<v Owen Gingerich>Well, I don't know.

604
00:54:54.760 --> 00:54:56.060
<v Owen Gingerich>It's a little bit hard,

605
00:54:56.140 --> 00:55:00.060
<v Owen Gingerich>but it's hard for us to place ourselves in that situation

606
00:55:00.060 --> 00:55:05.040
<v Owen Gingerich>where all of the power of authority is coming down against him

607
00:55:05.040 --> 00:55:09.580
<v Owen Gingerich>in a way that was essentially...

608
00:55:10.880 --> 00:55:14.680
<v Owen Gingerich>a trial and punishment for his rocking the boat politically,

609
00:55:15.680 --> 00:55:21.140
<v Owen Gingerich>for his disobeying orders in propagandizing for the Copernican system.

610
00:55:22.000 --> 00:55:24.360
<v Owen Gingerich>He was never found guilty of heresy.

611
00:55:24.900 --> 00:55:27.240
<v Owen Gingerich>And though in all the newspapers,

612
00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:30.620
<v Owen Gingerich>you sort of think, well, that's what the Pope was doing

613
00:55:31.360 --> 00:55:36.500
<v Owen Gingerich>10 years ago when Pope John Paul II announced

614
00:55:36.500 --> 00:55:40.860
<v Owen Gingerich>that really Galileo was okay,

615
00:55:40.880 --> 00:55:42.440
<v Owen Gingerich>and the church was forgiving him.

616
00:55:42.780 --> 00:55:45.160
<v Owen Gingerich>It wasn't quite like that

617
00:55:45.160 --> 00:55:49.700
<v Owen Gingerich>because if Galileo had been put on trial again,

618
00:55:49.800 --> 00:55:52.780
<v Owen Gingerich>he might have been found guilty of disobeying orders all over again.

619
00:55:54.500 --> 00:55:57.220
<v Owen Gingerich>But the Pope did say some interesting things.

620
00:55:58.240 --> 00:56:00.360
<v Owen Gingerich>He said that, interestingly enough,

621
00:56:01.000 --> 00:56:03.580
<v Owen Gingerich>Galileo was the better theologian

622
00:56:03.580 --> 00:56:05.980
<v Owen Gingerich>than those that he was contending with.

623
00:56:06.740 --> 00:56:10.520
<v Owen Gingerich>And he said the Bible...

624
00:56:10.880 --> 00:56:13.080
<v Owen Gingerich>doesn't tell how the heavens go,

625
00:56:13.280 --> 00:56:14.740
<v Owen Gingerich>but how to go to heaven.

626
00:56:15.260 --> 00:56:16.960
<v Owen Gingerich>Quoting in Latin,

627
00:56:17.640 --> 00:56:19.620
<v Owen Gingerich>where it doesn't have any rhythm at all,

628
00:56:20.900 --> 00:56:23.440
<v Owen Gingerich>in his statement.

629
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:27.300
<v Owen Gingerich>Well, the next slide will show us our Chetri,

630
00:56:27.480 --> 00:56:30.000
<v Owen Gingerich>the place where he was under house arrest

631
00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:31.980
<v Owen Gingerich>for all the rest of his life.

632
00:56:32.200 --> 00:56:36.780
<v Owen Gingerich>I can't tell you any more details about what went on there

633
00:56:36.780 --> 00:56:39.060
<v Owen Gingerich>because I've run myself out of time.

634
00:56:39.220 --> 00:56:40.640
<v Owen Gingerich>But I will show you one,

635
00:56:40.640 --> 00:56:41.420
<v Owen Gingerich>one last slide.

636
00:56:41.680 --> 00:56:46.400
<v Owen Gingerich>And that is the frontispiece of his complete works,

637
00:56:46.620 --> 00:56:49.620
<v Owen Gingerich>which were put out some years later,

638
00:56:49.820 --> 00:56:51.780
<v Owen Gingerich>same artist making the frontispiece.

639
00:56:52.240 --> 00:56:53.920
<v Owen Gingerich>They weren't terribly complete

640
00:56:53.920 --> 00:56:55.320
<v Owen Gingerich>because the Dialogo,

641
00:56:55.480 --> 00:56:57.500
<v Owen Gingerich>which was on the Index of Prohibited Books,

642
00:56:57.680 --> 00:56:58.960
<v Owen Gingerich>was not included.

643
00:56:59.180 --> 00:57:01.300
<v Owen Gingerich>But the rest of the works were done here.

644
00:57:01.480 --> 00:57:04.440
<v Owen Gingerich>And this is the coat of arms of the Medici family.

645
00:57:05.660 --> 00:57:08.300
<v Owen Gingerich>Six spheres in a hexagon.

646
00:57:08.600 --> 00:57:10.620
<v Owen Gingerich>But those aren't just ordinary spheres.

647
00:57:10.640 --> 00:57:11.100
<v Owen Gingerich>They're basic spheres.

648
00:57:12.080 --> 00:57:16.320
<v Owen Gingerich>Those are Jupiter with its satellites,

649
00:57:16.840 --> 00:57:18.680
<v Owen Gingerich>the moon with its mountains,

650
00:57:19.880 --> 00:57:21.500
<v Owen Gingerich>Saturn with its strange handles,

651
00:57:22.100 --> 00:57:23.680
<v Owen Gingerich>Venus with its phases,

652
00:57:24.540 --> 00:57:27.080
<v Owen Gingerich>and something I never really noticed before,

653
00:57:27.280 --> 00:57:29.040
<v Owen Gingerich>but what is in the center?

654
00:57:29.900 --> 00:57:30.280
<v Owen Gingerich>The sun.

655
00:57:31.160 --> 00:57:31.880
<v Owen Gingerich>Interesting.

656
00:57:33.100 --> 00:57:34.780
<v Owen Gingerich>So if you ask,

657
00:57:34.860 --> 00:57:37.880
<v Owen Gingerich>well, did the Medicis get their money's worth

658
00:57:37.880 --> 00:57:39.500
<v Owen Gingerich>hiring a mathematician

659
00:57:39.500 --> 00:57:40.620
<v Owen Gingerich>and, for example,

660
00:57:40.640 --> 00:57:41.120
<v Owen Gingerich>a philosopher,

661
00:57:41.300 --> 00:57:43.520
<v Owen Gingerich>I think you have to say they did.

662
00:57:43.760 --> 00:57:45.700
<v Owen Gingerich>And the other thing you have to say

663
00:57:45.700 --> 00:57:49.480
<v Owen Gingerich>is that Galileo may have lost the battle

664
00:57:49.480 --> 00:57:53.760
<v Owen Gingerich>as far as scientific proof positive was concerned,

665
00:57:53.960 --> 00:57:55.220
<v Owen Gingerich>but essentially,

666
00:57:56.000 --> 00:57:58.480
<v Owen Gingerich>he changed the rules of doing science.

667
00:57:58.940 --> 00:58:01.080
<v Owen Gingerich>And the way we now do science

668
00:58:01.080 --> 00:58:03.100
<v Owen Gingerich>is not to look for proofs

669
00:58:03.100 --> 00:58:05.980
<v Owen Gingerich>and ironclad deductions,

670
00:58:05.980 --> 00:58:08.620
<v Owen Gingerich>but for trying to make a system

671
00:58:08.620 --> 00:58:09.820
<v Owen Gingerich>that's coherent,

672
00:58:10.640 --> 00:58:11.440
<v Owen Gingerich>and hangs together,

673
00:58:12.480 --> 00:58:14.080
<v Owen Gingerich>and that is what science today

674
00:58:14.080 --> 00:58:15.920
<v Owen Gingerich>continues to be all about.

675
00:58:16.480 --> 00:58:17.260
<v Owen Gingerich>Thank you.

676
00:58:31.240 --> 00:58:32.440
<v Paul Davies>Thank you.

677
00:58:36.820 --> 00:58:39.240
<v Paul Davies>Well, thank you so much, Erin,

678
00:58:39.320 --> 00:58:40.120
<v Paul Davies>for weaving together.

679
00:58:40.120 --> 00:58:41.600
<v Paul Davies>The science, the history,

680
00:58:41.680 --> 00:58:43.400
<v Paul Davies>and the religion in such a fascinating way.

681
00:58:43.680 --> 00:58:44.940
<v Paul Davies>Now, as promised,

682
00:58:45.040 --> 00:58:46.180
<v Paul Davies>we do have some time,

683
00:58:46.180 --> 00:58:49.500
<v Paul Davies>just a little under 15 minutes for questions.

684
00:58:49.740 --> 00:58:51.380
<v Paul Davies>So is there a lady waiting there?

685
00:58:53.120 --> 00:58:54.300
<v Audience>There's a theory today

686
00:58:54.300 --> 00:58:55.940
<v Audience>about the universe

687
00:58:55.940 --> 00:58:59.060
<v Audience>that everyone and everyone that lives in it

688
00:58:59.060 --> 00:59:00.160
<v Audience>are all connected.

689
00:59:00.540 --> 00:59:01.580
<v Audience>Do you believe in that?

690
00:59:03.600 --> 00:59:06.800
<v Owen Gingerich>I guess I would have to say yes,

691
00:59:06.880 --> 00:59:09.100
<v Owen Gingerich>because we're all made

692
00:59:10.120 --> 00:59:18.960
<v Owen Gingerich>of cosmic ashes. We're star stuff. We're made of elements that have come out in

693
00:59:18.960 --> 00:59:27.680
<v Owen Gingerich>the fiery furnaces of giant stars spread back in as supernovae. So there is a

694
00:59:27.680 --> 00:59:30.660
<v Owen Gingerich>wonderful connection between all of us and the cosmos.

695
00:59:35.040 --> 00:59:39.800
<v Paul Davies>I always love that poem about thou canst not stir a flower without troubling a

696
00:59:39.800 --> 00:59:43.760
<v Paul Davies>star. I just forget who wrote it. Gentleman here.

697
00:59:43.980 --> 00:59:52.020
<v Speaker 4>Professor, we seem to have a similar situation today with a certain ideology as

698
00:59:53.360 --> 01:00:01.240
<v Speaker 4>Galileo was faced with, and that is about the Holocaust. I come from a group of

699
01:00:01.240 --> 01:00:09.480
<v Speaker 4>individuals who want the proof that the alleged gas chambers existed. Now, again,

700
01:00:09.620 --> 01:00:09.780
<v Speaker 4>I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to answer that question.

701
01:00:09.780 --> 01:00:19.740
<v Speaker 4>The response is typical. Now, what we are saying is that if they exist, then show me

702
01:00:19.740 --> 01:00:26.560
<v Speaker 4>or draw me these gas chambers. Now, instead of going into an argument with us or opening

703
01:00:26.560 --> 01:00:33.600
<v Speaker 4>themselves to our position and working out a dialogue and trying to solve this, we are

704
01:00:33.600 --> 01:00:36.560
<v Speaker 4>being persecuted in the courts, in the federal court.

705
01:00:36.860 --> 01:00:39.760
<v Paul Davies>With respect, sir, I don't think this is related to Gavro.

706
01:00:39.780 --> 01:00:41.600
<v Paul Davies>I think it's related to Galileo, which is the subject of the...

707
01:00:41.600 --> 01:00:46.980
<v Speaker 4>Oh, no, no, no, no, no. It's persecution of another point of view.

708
01:00:47.980 --> 01:00:53.600
<v Paul Davies>Yes, but it's not a point of view that I think it's our task to be examining here this afternoon.

709
01:00:54.000 --> 01:00:57.300
<v Speaker 4>Oh, I don't expect you to. I just wanted your comment on that, Professor.

710
01:00:57.340 --> 01:01:01.120
<v Paul Davies>And particularly given the time limitations. I don't know whether you want to make brief

711
01:01:01.120 --> 01:01:02.940
<v Paul Davies>comment, Owen, or we want to move on to the next...

712
01:01:02.940 --> 01:01:08.300
<v Owen Gingerich>Well, I would say that from how I've described what Galileo was doing, he was looking for

713
01:01:08.300 --> 01:01:16.840
<v Owen Gingerich>a coherency of how things held together. He was not asking for absolute proof of the

714
01:01:16.840 --> 01:01:19.680
<v Owen Gingerich>sort that you seem to be requiring.

715
01:01:20.660 --> 01:01:23.720
<v Speaker 4>Does science want to know instead of believing?

716
01:01:24.240 --> 01:01:28.580
<v Paul Davies>I do feel we should move on to the next question, just in the interest of the time.

717
01:01:31.280 --> 01:01:35.160
<v Paul Davies>Do we have another question about Galileo specifically?

718
01:01:36.820 --> 01:01:38.280
<v Paul Davies>Well, I have...

719
01:01:38.300 --> 01:01:40.300
<v Owen Gingerich>Yes, there will be, right up there in the balcony.

720
01:01:41.040 --> 01:01:44.040
<v Paul Davies>I forgot to mention we have another microphone at the top.

721
01:01:44.120 --> 01:01:44.400
<v Paul Davies>Thank you, Professor.

722
01:01:44.400 --> 01:01:47.140
<v Paul Davies>So people in the gallery, please feel free to come forward. Yes, sir.

723
01:01:47.260 --> 01:01:53.820
<v Audience>Thank you. Galileo did other things as well. Could you please enlighten us what other contribution

724
01:01:53.820 --> 01:01:57.380
<v Audience>he made with his artistic life?

725
01:01:57.640 --> 01:02:02.720
<v Owen Gingerich>I have been talking about his astronomy in particular, because that's what had got him

726
01:02:02.720 --> 01:02:07.240
<v Owen Gingerich>in trouble with the Inquisition and what makes the story so dramatic.

727
01:02:07.240 --> 01:02:16.600
<v Owen Gingerich>But he had been working all his life on motion, on inertial motion, which turned out to be

728
01:02:16.600 --> 01:02:24.500
<v Owen Gingerich>absolutely key to what Newton was then to do. That work he finally wrote up while he

729
01:02:24.500 --> 01:02:34.160
<v Owen Gingerich>was in house arrest in our Chetri. And of course, it was very circumscribed as to what

730
01:02:34.160 --> 01:02:36.320
<v Owen Gingerich>kind of visitors he could have and so on.

731
01:02:37.300 --> 01:02:43.480
<v Owen Gingerich>But the ambassador from Holland did come through and he was allowed to go and see him. And

732
01:02:43.480 --> 01:02:50.060
<v Owen Gingerich>then for some curious reason, this book appeared in Leiden. I mean, how in the world can you

733
01:02:50.060 --> 01:02:50.920
<v Owen Gingerich>understand that?

734
01:02:55.100 --> 01:02:56.560
<v Paul Davies>Are you waiting to ask a question?

735
01:02:56.760 --> 01:02:56.900
<v Paul Davies>Yes.

736
01:02:57.000 --> 01:02:57.440
<v Paul Davies>Go ahead.

737
01:02:57.840 --> 01:03:04.240
<v Owen Gingerich>I haven't necessarily given full credit to the other work that Galileo did, but in

738
01:03:04.240 --> 01:03:07.220
<v Owen Gingerich>terms of the actual lasting scientific work...

739
01:03:07.220 --> 01:03:13.560
<v Owen Gingerich>His discourse on the two new sciences, that book that was published at the end of his

740
01:03:13.560 --> 01:03:18.520
<v Owen Gingerich>life is perhaps the most substantial of his scientific contributions.

741
01:03:22.340 --> 01:03:28.040
<v Audience>Yeah. It just seems to me what you've been saying that Galileo suffered, I guess, a fair

742
01:03:28.040 --> 01:03:35.060
<v Audience>amount of, I guess, scientific persecution for his views and how what he thought was

743
01:03:35.060 --> 01:03:37.200
<v Audience>the truth in a world which didn't really want to believe it.

744
01:03:37.220 --> 01:03:46.800
<v Audience>In your experience as a scientist in today's age, do we still at all, I suppose, persecute

745
01:03:46.800 --> 01:03:51.960
<v Audience>new scientific beliefs if they don't agree with the status quo, just as in Galileo's

746
01:03:51.960 --> 01:03:56.900
<v Audience>time he didn't agree with the church's view? Does that still happen today or are we moving

747
01:03:56.900 --> 01:04:01.000
<v Audience>beyond that and accepting new theories and new ideas much better?

748
01:04:02.500 --> 01:04:06.760
<v Owen Gingerich>Well, I suppose you can't exactly say that.

749
01:04:06.780 --> 01:04:07.200
<v Owen Gingerich>Yeah.

750
01:04:07.220 --> 01:04:16.020
<v Owen Gingerich>I think that Darwin was persecuted, although his work has been widely criticized and a

751
01:04:16.020 --> 01:04:23.660
<v Owen Gingerich>lot of people feel that somehow all the troubles of modern society can be attributed to him.

752
01:04:24.120 --> 01:04:33.600
<v Owen Gingerich>But otherwise, it's very hard to think of a case where somebody has a tremendous idea

753
01:04:33.600 --> 01:04:36.060
<v Owen Gingerich>and has a terrible time.

754
01:04:37.220 --> 01:04:39.320
<v Owen Gingerich>And that's not getting anybody to take it seriously.

755
01:04:40.260 --> 01:04:50.600
<v Owen Gingerich>Occasionally, you do find some interesting situation where a very interesting idea hasn't

756
01:04:50.600 --> 01:04:58.840
<v Owen Gingerich>surfaced as quickly as it might, but I don't offhand think of anything that begins to be

757
01:04:58.840 --> 01:04:59.360
<v Owen Gingerich>comparable.

758
01:04:59.800 --> 01:05:03.840
<v Paul Davies>Yes, persecution is a rather strong word.

759
01:05:04.000 --> 01:05:06.780
<v Paul Davies>I mean, one sometimes feels one's colleagues are being beastly.

760
01:05:06.800 --> 01:05:07.200
<v Paul Davies>Yeah.

761
01:05:11.020 --> 01:05:14.440
<v Paul Davies>but of course there are certainly examples

762
01:05:14.440 --> 01:05:16.760
<v Paul Davies>like Wegener's theory of continental drift

763
01:05:16.760 --> 01:05:20.840
<v Paul Davies>where it took some decades before true recognition was given to the idea

764
01:05:20.840 --> 01:05:25.020
<v Paul Davies>but my feeling very much in the physical sciences

765
01:05:25.020 --> 01:05:27.720
<v Paul Davies>is that the truth will out pretty quickly

766
01:05:27.720 --> 01:05:31.040
<v Paul Davies>and if you look back through the history of ideas in physics

767
01:05:31.040 --> 01:05:32.780
<v Paul Davies>I think it's only right and proper

768
01:05:32.780 --> 01:05:35.720
<v Paul Davies>that they're battle tested against a sceptical scientific community

769
01:05:35.720 --> 01:05:39.320
<v Paul Davies>because where would science be if everybody's crazy idea

770
01:05:39.320 --> 01:05:41.620
<v Paul Davies>was accepted as as good as everybody else's

771
01:05:41.620 --> 01:05:45.260
<v Paul Davies>there has to be a sceptical community that you must get past

772
01:05:45.260 --> 01:05:49.280
<v Paul Davies>and then that gives you greater faith in the theory if it survives that

773
01:05:49.280 --> 01:05:52.680
<v Paul Davies>so I think we've moved beyond the stage

774
01:05:52.680 --> 01:05:56.680
<v Paul Davies>of course there are sociological factors at work in science as everywhere

775
01:05:57.300 --> 01:05:59.540
<v Paul Davies>but in the end it all averages out

776
01:05:59.540 --> 01:06:02.160
<v Paul Davies>you get wonderful stories

777
01:06:02.160 --> 01:06:05.640
<v Owen Gingerich>for example when Einstein was being recommended

778
01:06:05.720 --> 01:06:08.380
<v Owen Gingerich>for a professorship in Berlin

779
01:06:08.380 --> 01:06:11.040
<v Owen Gingerich>one of the letters of recommendation said

780
01:06:11.040 --> 01:06:16.760
<v Owen Gingerich>well Einstein has worked so widely in so many different fields

781
01:06:16.760 --> 01:06:20.340
<v Owen Gingerich>it's inevitable that he would go astray someplace

782
01:06:20.340 --> 01:06:23.560
<v Owen Gingerich>for instance this idea about the photoelectric effect

783
01:06:23.560 --> 01:06:27.400
<v Owen Gingerich>and that's in the end what he won his Nobel Prize for

784
01:06:27.400 --> 01:06:31.820
<v Paul Davies>I wanted to just ask you briefly Owen

785
01:06:31.820 --> 01:06:35.600
<v Paul Davies>that one of the things Galileo did was discover sunspots

786
01:06:35.720 --> 01:06:36.440
<v Paul Davies>isn't that right?

787
01:06:36.740 --> 01:06:37.540
<v Paul Davies>that's correct

788
01:06:37.540 --> 01:06:40.520
<v Paul Davies>that probably got him into trouble too did it?

789
01:06:40.760 --> 01:06:41.960
<v Owen Gingerich>no not really

790
01:06:42.680 --> 01:06:49.360
<v Owen Gingerich>it got him in trouble only in the sense that he had quite a scrap about priority on it

791
01:06:49.360 --> 01:06:51.100
<v Owen Gingerich>with one of the Jesuit astronomers

792
01:06:51.100 --> 01:06:54.060
<v Owen Gingerich>who independently discovered them

793
01:06:54.060 --> 01:06:58.380
<v Owen Gingerich>and Galileo was of course as I said very anxious

794
01:06:58.380 --> 01:07:00.580
<v Owen Gingerich>to have all the credit for making all the discoveries

795
01:07:00.580 --> 01:07:05.020
<v Owen Gingerich>and was not very keen to share the credit in that particular case

796
01:07:05.020 --> 01:07:05.700
<v Owen Gingerich>but the thing is that Galileo was very anxious to have all the credit for making all the discoveries

797
01:07:05.720 --> 01:07:07.700
<v Owen Gingerich>the fact that the son was spotted

798
01:07:07.700 --> 01:07:11.960
<v Owen Gingerich>is something that would have been very anti-Aristotelian

799
01:07:11.960 --> 01:07:14.300
<v Owen Gingerich>but something that everybody took in their stride

800
01:07:14.300 --> 01:07:15.440
<v Owen Gingerich>almost immediately

801
01:07:15.440 --> 01:07:18.800
<v Paul Davies>there wasn't any anxiety about something in the heavens being flawed

802
01:07:18.800 --> 01:07:20.560
<v Paul Davies>or spotted

803
01:07:20.560 --> 01:07:22.840
<v Owen Gingerich>it was different but people

804
01:07:22.840 --> 01:07:24.720
<v Owen Gingerich>got on to the idea right away

805
01:07:24.720 --> 01:07:30.420
<v Owen Gingerich>and simply modified the Aristotelian ideas on that point

806
01:07:30.420 --> 01:07:33.840
<v Paul Davies>Now we have time for one last question if there is one

807
01:07:33.840 --> 01:07:34.960
<v Paul Davies>if there isn't

808
01:07:34.960 --> 01:07:35.700
<v Paul Davies>I know that the

809
01:07:35.700 --> 01:07:37.540
<v Paul Davies>the organisers would be only too delighted

810
01:07:37.540 --> 01:07:39.520
<v Paul Davies>if we would vacate a minute or two early

811
01:07:40.180 --> 01:07:40.620
<v Paul Davies>so

812
01:07:40.620 --> 01:07:43.660
<v Paul Davies>in which case it only remains for me to thank

813
01:07:43.660 --> 01:07:44.860
<v Paul Davies>Owen Gingrich again

814
01:07:45.620 --> 01:07:46.380
<v Paul Davies>very much

